It means this:

Beneath this mask there is more than flesh. There is a face beneath this mask, but it's not me. I'm no more that face than I am the muscles beneath it, or the bones beneath them. Beneath this mask there is an idea.

Our integrity sells for so little, but it is all we really have. It is the very last inch of us. But within that inch we are free. An Inch, it is small and it is fragile, but it is the only thing the world worth having. We must never lose it or give it away. We must never let them take it from us.

Fairness, justice, and freedom are more than words, they are perspectives.

Voilà! In view, a humble vaudevillian veteran, cast vicariously as both victim and villain by the vicissitudes of Fate. This visage, no mere veneer of vanity, is a vestige of the vox populi, now vacant, vanished. However, this valorous visitation of a by-gone vexation, stands vivified and has vowed to vanquish these venal and virulent vermin vanguarding vice and vouchsafing the violently vicious and voracious violation of volition.

Nice mix of quotes from the movie V for Vendetta. The Anonymous hacker group wore the mask a few days ago when they threatened to expose the Mexican drug cartel's connections. I suspect some occupying slacker saw the article and thought it looked cool.

Is that a quote from the movie? Why not quote from Marvel comics instead? Seriously though if you have to tell people what the mask stands for because the majority never seen the movie, it is quite funny.

If you are proud to be that 99%, and believe in the Occupy events, why hide your face? Why be anonymous? The protests are legal. No one is stopping you. The only people being arrested are the radicals breaking into places and burning things, things which the main part of the protest decries.

Granted, it's a cool looking mask. But you're not out there to look cool. You're are there to let your voice be heard. By hiding your face, you lose the respect of those who are not hiding.

Those who are proud say "My name is <insert name here>, and I don't like the way things are being done".

Time Warner (which also owns CNN) owns the rights to the masks, meaning every mask sold puts more money, albeit a small amount, into the corporation's coffers.

I find it ironic that the 99% in their efforts are propping up Time-Warner one of the most despised corporations of this time

We call that "chicken-$hit" down here. Our children wear mask's at Halloween...for "trick or treat"

Perfect clown masks for all the clowns to wear .... Now they just need the big shoes and rainbow wig and they are set.

Gen X/Y, do not pay any attention to these old farts and their anti-protest posts, we tried it their way for the last 25+ yrs and look where its gotten us...

BABY BOOMERS LEGACY: 15 plus trillion dollar national debt (and growing), 2 plus trillion dollar state and local debt (and growing), millions of uninsured (children and elderly), millions in bankruptcy (and foreclosure), disappearance of the middle class, economy wrecked, roads and bridges deteriorating, air polluted, pharmaceuticals in the water, hormones in the food, infrastructure (sewer and electrical) collapsing, educational system outdated, government for sell (bureaucrats and politicians), politically motivated judges, trillion dollar war, health care costs out of control, entire industries lost, military stretched thin, porous boarders, country more divided then ever (politically, religiously, racially), disliked by most of the world…

@ Jeff Jefferson maybe you didn't read the article correctly, it said Warner Brothers owns the rights to the mask, and these protesters bought knockoffs from China....

information@msnbc: tell your pals to occupy washington dc, thats where the root of the problems you mention are found. And dont forget to mention the wonderful things that the baby boomers left you, like the computer you are using and ipad and on and on...

I remember reading "Lord of the Flies" and the main antagonist had his followers paint themselves up in masks. One of the boys who did described how it freed him to do things he normally wouldn't, in this case very bad things that involved trying to kill the protagonist. A mask allows you to disassociate yourself from your actions, kind of like the way mob rule does. (They had mob rule in the book, too, and it was equally ugly.)

Gen X/Y, do not participate in repubs or dems primaries, only vote in the general elections... also, do not join and or sever all affiliations with said political parties... and absolutely, do not donate to the political party itself, only to the individual (not a repub or dem, if possible)

THIS WILL CAUSE THE DEMISE OF BOTH THE DEMS AND REPUBS, WHICH WILL GREATLY LIMIT SPECIAL INTEREST INFLUENCE IN AMERICAN GOVT

Guy Fawkes wanted to establish a Catholic theocracy to replace the Protestant theocracy. He's an odd choice of role model.

It's purely symbolic and because of the graphic novel/movie V for Vendetta.

Of course, I suspect the real reason people wear the masks is simply that they look cool.

I suspect you don't know what you're talking about.

@information@msnbc

#1.9, wonderful post! though i disagree that the democratic party and the republican party are equally as bad in every way. i hope you are not implying that. still, i am all for limiting special interests influence in politics. we all should be.

And speaking of quotes. One of my favorites from V.

People should not be afraid of their governments. Governments should be afraid of their people.

@Not a Socialists

You wouldn't know a "radical leftist" if one bit you on the nose. Nothing is moving radically to the left in this country. If they were, Obama's approval ratings wouldn't be in the toilet.

And those kids you think are "irrelevant" are the future...and thank heavens they've arrived...lol.

Jeff Jefferson-912478

I find it ironic that the 99% in their efforts are propping up Time-Warner one of the most despised corporations of this time

You must have missed the part in the article where it is said they are buying them from foreign manufacturers:

"several protesters said they were using foreign-made copies to circumvent the corporation."

Everything that I have I had to work for it! Nothing was ever handed to me. I am not the 1% and I will never be the 99% who thinks that this country owes me a living.

My parents didn't send me to school on their dime, I did it after I had two children, and after my wife completed her schooling. We both have student loans, and paying on them religiously. Never once we thought this was unfair to pay back our loans, and wanted someone to take care of them. Never once we thought that our house payment was unfair and wanted someone to take care of it. And never once I expected this country to owe me a living!!!

To all these kiddies that think when you get out of college, and there will be a job waiting for you... LOL you have another thing coming and you have been misinformed. It took over six months for me to find a job in my profession, but I didn't give up! I worked at a department store until I was able to find a job. I didn't complain, whine, or wanted some kind of a handout... I did what I had to do! I got a job, it's really not that hard.

The OWS started out to be something to believe in, but it lack leadership and reasoning, you all lost your direction on how to present yourselves. Now all I see is bunch of kids complaining about how they don't get their far share. And instead of working you rather sit in a park and smoke pot. I have no respect for any lazy, pot smoking, society draining bums! You don't need a handout, what you need a foot in your arse!

@Elle-1709289

And those kids you think are "irrelevant" are the future...and thank heavens they've arrived...lol.

thank heavens indeed: here is 2004 and here is 2008, according to those irrelevant kids. the next 20 years cannot come soon enough.

sorry I ment "fair share" and not far...

If you are proud to be that 99%, and believe in the Occupy events, why hide your face? Why be anonymous?

It's not about anonymity, it's about solidarity.

@12thman

yeah. go ahead and keep working harder and harder for less and less. keep working harder while your employers lay off your co-workers and you have to take up their responsibilities. keep working harder and harder while the margin of profit off your work shifted from your to your employer more and more.

keep working harder and harder while your job is less safe, has less benefits, and pays less. keep working harder and harder while you scrap your pennies together to pay for your kids to go to college, where costs have tripled in the last 20 years.

keep working harder and harder because when its time for you to retire, and you worked at or close to minimum wage your whole life, there may be nobody there to help. and if you have severe health problems while retired? hope you worked really hard.

but then again, those pot smokers you have so much disdain for may just get their way so that you are never left out in the cold if you are ever down on your luck. so that you can keep pretending that people who fight for a fairer and more just society had no influence over how well you are doing. and so that you can keep bashing them over the had and hurling insults at them ad nauseum, instead of having the living standards of a third world country.

"several protesters said they were using foreign-made copies to circumvent the corporation"

So instead of giving money to the American Corporation, they encourage the exploitation of the sweat shop workers in China, run by Chinese Corporations?

More like it is about ignorance and being so ignorant they can be led like sheep.

Not a Socialist-1286940 - Good choice of screen name however I think "Am a Corporatist" might be a little more accurate. I'm curious as to how much your corporate masters pay you per post. Either that or you are solidly part of the 1% and actively working to keep the 99% of the American People down. Either way, I've wasted enough time on you...be gone troll.

JustaGrunt:

Thank you, I'm glad I'm not the only one that picked up on that. So to avoid paying royalties to Time Warner, they bought Chinese knock-offs instead. Isn't that also what they're protesting? People sending jobs overseas and people buying foreign products, like at Walmart, because they're cheaper, rather than buying American made?

12thman, well said.

Don't worry Zaruski, I will work harder and harder and earn everything that I worked hard for. For I am an American! I respect my country, and what it means to me!

@zaruski

i disagree that the democratic party and the republican party are equally as bad...

that's debatable... i say two sides of the same coin

Magnolia, well to be fair, more then likely the ones that are licensed by WB are more then likely made in China as well. I just thought that it was funny that they are protesting the decline of the middle class, by buying a product from a country that helped fuel that decline.

When I saw the movie V for Vendetta - I and most of the rest of the crowded theatre walked out with this tense feeling - a feeling of.. unease.. The movie struck a powerful chord for many many people - of all ages. My mother (one of the Boomers) also had that feeling. IWe felt uneasy because the movie was pointing a finger right at what was happening in our own country. Most people picked up on that. But many will never pick up on it. Those that escape the pain that is being meted out in this country can feel free to treat these protesters with disdain.

I knew when I saw this movie, that the mask of Guy Fawkes would be worn by protesters when the protests finally broke out. That was 5 years ago. I knew things were bad then.

This article angers me. First, thanks MSNBC for pointing out the OBVIOUS - these masks have been being worn for a few years now - including at the World Trade meetings. They are showing up globally. And the imagery of Guy Fawkes has been worn in England on the 5th of November for centuries!

In fact, this article once again reminds me of the movie, and of a propaganda ministry. MSNBC - a corporate mouthpiece for the minority in control. Too many times the article makes veiled swipes at the protesters. It makes a point of quoting those who dont grasp the deeper meanings of the masks, when it could have just as easily quoted protesters with a voluminous knowledge of Fawkes the movie, the holiday, the meaning. It makes a point to compare the wearing of the mask to a terrorist - McVeigh. It calls Guy Fawkes a criminal. When in fact, its amazing how when uprisings are successful, people like Fawkes are frequently remembered as heroes. History is strange that way... The article makes allusions of possible drug use (rolling cigarettes, sleepy eyed). The article makes sure to point out that the imagery is owned by a corporation and the masks worn by the protesters are made in China (what isn't today?).

Those of you calling these people thugs and kids really need to wake up and look around you. These "kids" are young adults that can't find living-wage jobs. These kids dont have the same opportunities that were available to the boom generation. There are few opportunities for learning on the job. No longer can a family live COMFORTABLY (and we are talking the standard of living circa 1960s here) on a single blue-collar wage. Homes are STILL priced out of the reach of most of these "kids" and they are now crushed with the college debt that they were told not to worry about because that great job waiting for them would be more than sufficient to pay the loans off with money to spare for mortgage and middle class life. They were lied to, and they know it.

Uprisings (not mobs, not riots) are always started by the youngest adults in a society. History shows us that too. History shows that social unrest is practically inevitable when an entire generation of young adults are left idle. These uprisings are happening around the globe, because this is a "New World Order" issue. Ive seen it developing for over 20 years now. I was pondering this very scenario in my mind back in the mid 1990s. I knew things were going to get ugly. I knew wage disparity was growing, that children were being neglected because mothers were overworked for the need to earn that (now) ever-important second income.

Our society is wildly dysfunctional. Mental illness - depression - anxiety is at epidemic levels. Children are neurotic and insecure. We have allowed the very rich to push us all into a dystopian society where children are carted off into the care of a legion of strangers because mom needs to work. That fact alone is evidence enough that we have big problems here. But it never gets lipservice.

I for one am proud of the youngest adults among us. They are standing up with courage.

They are likely to quiet down a bit when the snow flies in NYC, but as soon as the leaves start sprouting again in the Spring, we will have our American Spring.

I for one am sick to death of corporate media and of the imbecilic commenters on here who refuse to acknowledge these protesters for what they are. Angry, disillusioned. You critics on here - you could care less about the fact that we have slid into a kind of corporate fascism - 'cause you got yours. And you walked 5 miles uphill - both ways - in the snow to school as a kid, and you liked it that way. You worked hard for everything you got. Nobody EVER gave you a thing. I bet you even crawled out to the barn as an infant to suckle from Bessy the Cow because you wanted no handouts. It was ALL you. Get out of the way, sit down, collect your social security, and SHUT up.

History is upon you whether you like it or not, and the Guy Fawkes imagery has been around for a very long time. Its also not lost on me that this article failed to touch upon the fact that tomorrow is Guy Fawkes day - celebrated in England for centuries now by the people. It had long ago turned into a subversive celebration under the noses of the Lords and Ladies - one that celebrated the fierce independence of the people - even while under tyrannical rule. It is a celebration of resistance.

Remember remember the 5th of November - Gunpowder, treason and plot. I see no reason why gunpowder treason should ever be forgot....

While Warner Brothers holds the licensing rights to the Guy Fawkes mask, several protesters said they were using foreign-made copies to circumvent the corporation....

Ha. What a bunch of hypocrites. Isn't one of the things these people are protesting the fact that corporations are shipping jobs oversees and there is no work for American workes? And now they go to buy goods produced in foreign countries to line the pockets of foriegn corporations rather than American corporations that employee Americans!

Hehe, few people realize how many lives Alan Moore has touched.

It's not only that they're buying cheap Chinese knock-offs online, it's the sheer hypocrisy of selling them to their fellow protestors for $5.00 a pop!!

One was in the left hand of 32-year-old Jason J. Cross — right under a protest sign. He had 20 more stashed in his tent, to be sold at $5 apiece.

"I had 10 here yesterday, and I sold out!" he said.

Cross said he'd purchased 100 of the Chinese-made masks online.

Isn't that part of their protest? Capitalism at its finest!! How ironic. And, just out of curiosity - where were they delivered? UPS delivers to Zuccotti Park? Or did someone see a potential goldmine and, after having them delivered to their home, decide to join the protest for profit and gain? LOL!!

@12thman

correct. while you keep working harder and harder for less and less, your employer works less and less for more and more.

the result? OWS. you just havent come to that realization yet.

Come on let's not ruin the status quo for Socialist-1286940 and other perfectly complacent posters, we really don't want to ruin their delusions of superiority and grandeur.

@ STLMike

It's not that the companies went overseas, it's because they went overseas to bypass labor laws, environmental laws and dodge paying taxes. What do you think would happen if products imported from China were only allowed if they paid their workers minimum wage? Prices wouldn't increase that much for it to be made in the U.S., but it would shave some of that profit margin from people who didn't put any work in to earn it. The U.S. is not a capitalist society. Corporations are thriving on welfare (tax breaks/incentives and bail-outs) when they make mistakes, but they don't contribute when they're making money. If individuals are to blame for over-extending themselves on their loans, then the investors should be to blame for lending money to people of high risk. Make it so the banks can't play musical chairs with bad debt (they have to keep it, not sell it to someone else).

Hey info@msnbc,

With a name like that, I can't think of anything worse to call you. The biggest mistake baby boomers made was to raise a bunch of crybaby morons that think the world owes them something. You forgot that one. Your relevence is judged by accomplishments and I am thinking that "occupying" really is not much of an accomplishment. I guess we could rank it with breathing, surviving, or just taking up space. Let me know when you earn something. Then I am sure you will reap what you sow.

Don't worry Zaruski, I will work harder and harder and earn everything that I worked hard for. For I am an American! I respect my country, and what it means to me!

Well, I guess it's not slavery if he volunteers for it...

"Guy Fawkes wanted to establish a Catholic theocracy"

And who wrote that history? Likely the same people who had him executed. While no one can be sure what Fawkes true motivations were through hundreds of years of claims by both sides you can be sure that the "victors" weren't writing an accurate telling of events. What we can be sure of is that the protesters use of the masks is in relation to a film/graphic novel named "V for Vendetta", which is a story about an individual using questionable means to topple a violent, murderous government which uses fear, hatred, lies & bio-terrorism to keep its citizens under their control.

Judging by all the ethos responses above - I'd say the mask is working very well. The mask is totally about V for Vendetta and its symbolism and not about some dude from 1600 London. This "comic" the used all over the USA in Wrt101 classes - it is a great Rhetorical writing tool - something the above whiners wouldn't know about. When you can use logos and pathos in addition to our uncontrolled ethos - then we might actually listen to your (non)rhetorical argument - and anxiously await replying with our own rhetorical arguments.

V for Vendetta is one of the most inspiring movies of all time. Guy Fawkes was a freedom fighter. The spirit of V for Vendetta, and the masks, is to overthrow the King. America was not supposed to be governed by royalty, but the corporations and politicians they own function as a form of royalty. The Republican and Democrat parties are both owned. Protesting is a start. Voting doesn't work because the process has been corrupted and most politicians are bought off.

I don't seem to remember firebombs, rapes, graffitti & hundreds of arrests at the tea party's protests.

1. Forgiveness of all debts (sort of like the Apostles Creed of OWS)

2. Ban private ownership of land

3. Make minimum wage >$20/hr

4. Lower retirement age to 50

5. Unionize all workers

6. Legally enforce a 6 hour maximum work day

Coleslaw (below), doesn't that sound like the benefits that they get in Greece? ....and we all know how well that worked out.

StrengthinNumbers- Awesome post. You said practically everything I have felt since this whole issue started 2 months ago. These young people are not the dregs of society, but have simply found themselves disadvantaged by the very system that has implied for decades that everything is secure. I only hope more people, especially the naysayers, will find wisdom in your post.

As for the article, I have a few things to say.

First of all, SHAME ON YOU MSNBC for this horrible, horrible, piss-poor mockery of journalism!!! The entire article was rife with the author's blatant bias and subjectivity towards the OWS movement. Nearly every paragraph contained some underhanded insult or smear of the person interviewed. This is absolutely intolerable! Even the corporatist uber-conservative hatemongers should be able to ascertain that this article is pure bunk. Where the hell is the REAL journalism??? Granted, MSNBC is still far head of that second-rate tabloid junk we call Fox News, but just within the last few years I have seen the quality of MSNBC's journalism drop significantly. It is shameful, and it only serves to diminish my respect for this organization.

As for the Guy Fawkes issue, great spin by the f---ing media to completely subvert the true spirit of what Fawkes was against. I love how the article states, "While Fawkes' image has been romanticized over the past 400 years, he was a criminal who tried to blow up a government building. It would be hard to imagine Americans one day wearing Timothy McVeigh masks to protest the government or corporate greed." Oh, really?

Did the article bother to go into the real reasons behind the Fawkes incident at the time? Of course not. I really don't have time to go into this right now, but the historical aspects are easily found online for those who care about such things.

So, my argument is this: Before the start of the American Revolution, there were several young men who decided one night that they were fed up with the taxes that were being imposed upon the colonists by the British throne. They were also disenfranchised with the fact that the British crown was denying their right to produce goods without having to pay duties, tariffs, etc. SO these young men, got dressed up as "indians", and surreptitiously climbed aboard a merchant vessel in the local harbor. They carried with them violent weapons (axes, to be exact) and proceeded to smash the numerous boxes of imported tea and throw the contents overboard into the harbor. This, of course, did not go over well with the authority at the time, and led to significant attempts to crack down on the vandal thugs who committed the crimes.

In the context of Guy Fawkes, and within the perceptions of many readers on this forum, these vandals were nothing but hooligans who were simply out to create havoc and chaos, taking the opportunity of the moment to commit crimes. These vandals should have been arrested, tried, and prosecuted for their actions. Nothing more, nothing less.

But on the contrary, history has had a much more favorable view of this event, as it was one of the many actions that inevitably led up to the foundation of the American Revolution, hence the birth of our nation and way of life. Of course, I'm alluding to what is known as the "Boston Tea Party".

It is about perception. It is about how we view the brevity of the actions that people are led to perform out of desperation and necessity.

Please keep in mind, that before the outbreak of war in our country nearly 230 years ago, the MAJORITY of the inhabitants at the time were still loyal to the British throne, and viewed the beginnings of the American uprisings as nothing but criminal and treasonous.

The point is, let's not summarily dismiss the OWS protestors just yet until we fully understand what the movement is truly all about. ALL revolutions start the same way- disorganized, fragmented, and without a common voice. Then, as time goes by, it transforms into a real movement with a purpose. Let's focus on the purpose, and not the petty things that are being peddled in order to discredit the people and their fundamental concerns.

Ano -

What we can be sure of is that the protesters use of the masks is in relation to a film/graphic novel named "V for Vendetta", which is a story about an individual using questionable means to topple a violent, murderous government which uses fear, hatred, lies & bio-terrorism to keep its citizens under their control.

Yes.

Ironic however that OWS is protesting corporate greed and it wants more government control to spread the wealth, where the plot in V for Vendetta centered around a revolutionary trying to undo big government control. Kind of the other way around, isn't it?

Fujikoma -

The US cannot control wages in Foreign countries. Would you want China telling us what we must pay for labor here? Or what our environmental regulations should be?

It's called sovereignty.

And if our wages plus taxes plus regulations plus work ethic plus liabilities all add up to a company making more by producing products overseas - whose fault is that?

And even if you had a magic wand that could somehow force companies to stay here, what about their foreign competitiors?

Their competitors would love nothing more than for US companies to not be able to do anything overseas.

Like many of our industries that tried to stay here - they are now gone.

So then the question becomes, what can we do to make the US a place where companies don't want to leave or even to come here.

If you don't want to do that with lower wages, then you could cut taxes, regulations or other impediments to doing business.

The problem is the same people whining about companies not paying enough also want higher taxes and more regulations.

That's not going to work.

And since well under half of Americans work now, the easiest answer is more people working. Only 1 in 3 Americans work full time - while 2/3 of Federal Spending is Entitlements.

If we curtail entitlements, more people will be willing to work.

Their are farm communities with high unemployment AND CROPS ROTTING IN THE FIELDS BECAUSE NO ONE IS WILLING TO WORK.

And why would they? They get free food, housing, medical care, education and spending money HANDED to them for doing nothing.

If we don't change that - expect other countries to take more of our jobs.

StrengthinNumbers, you are absolutely correct.

I recently watched V for Vendetta, is it is scary how similar the corrupt, fascist government represents Republicans and the Tea Party. My wife and I made the comment that all the oppressive actions, the tyranny, the fascism represented in that evil government is an EXACT thing the Tea Party wants.

In the movie, the fascist government has a motto: "Strength through unity, Unity through faith". FAITH, in the religion they have dictated for their people. FAITH, in a "Christian" nation ruled by "Christian" laws. How many times have we heard Sara Palin and other Tea Party leaders push for a "Christian" nation, ruled by "Christian" laws?

In the movie, the fascist government has banned all Korans and made owning one a crime, punishable by death. Republicans and the Tea Party would LOVE to do this. You already see the support for this in any article about Muslims... and the Republican reaction. They hate anything and everything to do with the Koran, and I guarantee that they would jump at the chance to ban it. In fact, I have seen calls to ban it on these same forums.

In the movie, the fascist government has made homosexuality a crime, punishable by life in prison. Show me a single Republican that does not wish for this, and I will show you a liar. We see the hatred for homosexuals drip off every Republican tongue, we feel the rage burning in their words. If given power, the Tea Party would lock-up every homosexual in the name of "morality" and "religion."

In the movie, the fascist government owns the media, controlling the message the people hear. They twist facts, lie and spin the stories to benefit themselves. If this is not Fox News, I don't know what is.

Finally, in the movie, the final straw is when a police officer shoots and kills a protestor after outlawing the mask... a very young girl. Look at the Republicans now. What are they asking for? They want the police to step in and stop the 99% protestors. They want the protestors to be arrested. I have even seen some Republicans call for their death. Will there be another shot heard 'round the world?

The V for Vendetta mask is a symbol for freedom... freedom for the everyday person. FREEDOM from tyranny. FREEDOM from oppression. FREEDOM to live YOUR life. FREEDOM from a corrupt government. FREEDOM to own whatever book you want. FREEDOM to love whoever you want. FREEDOM to choose whatever religion you want. FREEDOM to elect a government that represents you, the people. FREEDOM from a ruling class that controls your life. FREEDOM to live in a country where the laws are created to benefit society, not just the rich. FREEDOM to live in a country where the people have a voice. FREEDOM from people telling you how to live.

Beneath this mask there is an idea...

Fairness, justice, and freedom are more than words, they are perspectives.

"There's a lot of inherent ironies in protesting corporations in a corporate world,"

Indeed. The protesters buy and use the products from the very same corporations that they are protesting against.

If this movement keeps going the way it's going they'll have to change it's name to "Occupy Jail Cell".

Thank you Indy - and thank you for pointing out the REAL tea party in its proper historical perspective. It disgusts me that the very people who have co-opted the words "Tea Party" fail to see that the OWS movement is more true to the actual historical events than their false-patriotism movement. I resent that the Tea Party movement has managed to co-opt and therefore besmirch the good reputation of the original colonial tea partiers.

How is protesting against the protesters from behind the mask of a computer monitor any more courageous than the Guy Fawks mask wearers?

Look at how many people use avatars to bolster their self image or mock others on the Internet.

Taking the "anti" argument isn't even an argument - it is just venting. A few have logical objections - that is until they revert to name calling and uncontrolled anger.

Personally, I never viewed OWS as any kind of a "movement." They've proved to be just a bunch of fringe loonies who have never been taught any sense of responsibility and are just looking for attention and freebies. Since the media decided to create develop this into their event, the thugs have joined to. I guess you get to camp out without having to pay the fee for a camp site. Heck, as hippies we were cleaner than they are and more articulate.

@Jrs952

Don't worry Zaruski, I will work harder and harder and earn everything that I worked hard for. For I am an American! I respect my country, and what it means to me!

Well, I guess it's not slavery if he volunteers for it...

And being successful doesn't mean sitting on your arse asking for handouts!!!

"It's not about bombing anything; it's about being anonymous — and peaceful."

Uh...it's not about bombing anything...yet you chose the mask of a terrorist...it's about being peaceful...but again, you chose the mask of a terrorist...

It would make more sense to wear a Barney the Dinosaur mask...

Oh Roy - do you ever read anything from a point of view other than your own? The masks are bootlegs from China - I wouldn't doubt the movie company that owns the rights to the mask are behind the arrests of those who wear them. It's only okay to be a rebel when it suits Roy's own agendas.

"Cross said he'd purchased 100 of the Chinese-made masks online"

Nice. Support the Chinese low-wage manufacturing plants that take jobs from Americans and Europeans alike. Just another example of how this movements actions contradict their reason for existence. Seems to me that the downfall of this movement will be the youth that are struggling so hard to identify with something they don't even fully understand what they're identifying with.

Corporations provided them with the toilet paper that they used after they defecated, per their 'movement', on the middle-class tax payers' police cars...but then again, perhaps they didn't bother to wipe...

Former GOP - in regard to your comment "In the movie, the fascist government has made homosexuality a crime, punishable by life in prison. Show me a single Republican that does not wish for this, and I will show you a liar. We see the hatred for homosexuals drip off every Republican tongue, we feel the rage burning in their words. If given power, the Tea Party would lock-up every homosexual in the name of "morality" and "religion."

As a 59 year-old Republican, I take issue with many of your generalizations...but this one is sooooo stupid: In the movie, the fascist government has made homosexuality a crime, punishable by life in prison. Show me a single Republican that does not wish for this, and I will show you a liar. We see the hatred for homosexuals drip off every Republican tongue, we feel the rage burning in their words. If given power, the Tea Party would lock-up every homosexual in the name of "morality" and "religion."

Neither my husband or I believe this way...my sister and sister-in-law are lesbians, our roommates are lesbians, and many of our other friends are also gay. So, not all Republican Boomers are the way you proclaim us to be.

So many of the posters on this thread have made such ridiculous generalizations in order to validate their own feelings. When you make these sorts of generalizations, you are no better than the people you are condemning.

JustaGrunt:

Magnolia, well to be fair, more then likely the ones that are licensed by WB are more then likely made in China as well. I just thought that it was funny that they are protesting the decline of the middle class, by buying a product from a country that helped fuel that decline.

Oh, absolutely. I'm sure the licensed masks are made overseas as well. I'm by no means giving Time Warner a pass, but I also saw the irony there, and I'm glad I'm not the only one.

I think that, instead of a mask, they should all get tattoos on their face that say, "I am a lazy idiot that wants stuff I haven't earned".

article...."One (mask) was in the left hand of 32-year-old Jason J. Cross — right under a protest sign. He had 20 more stashed in his tent, to be sold at $5 apiece.

"I had 10 here yesterday, and I sold out!" he said."....

This protest is not about ending Capitalism. They are about a fair playing field. It is pointed out by Cross' small enterprise, keeps him in coffee while protesting.

Those who are already 30, under educated - or educated and under-employed, may be America's version of what Japan calls their "Lost Generation". They had over 10 years of stagflation, and a whole lot of "kids" still living at home under-employed...those lost earning/job experience years are painfully lost.

@ zaruski - the only reason we are making less is because the Democrats are sticking their hands in our pockets more often, taking more and more to use to buy votes from the entitlement crowd and other like-minded folks. They are the ones who need to go.

The mask is a stylized version of Guy Fawkes, an Englishman who tried to bomb the British Parliament on Nov. 5, 1605.

"They're very meaningful masks," said Alexandra Ricciardelli, who was rolling cigarettes on a table outside her tent in New York's Zuccotti Park two days before the anniversary of Fawkes' failed bombing attempt.

"It's not about bombing anything; it's about being anonymous — and peaceful."

You, know, they're not that meaningful. Unless everyone knows what they represent before you start wearing them, then they mean nothing to the majority who've never seen them.

And what is significant about being peaceful and anonymous? As I see it, it makes you more easy to forget.

Just another example of how the OWS is clueless.

Former GOP -

My wife and I made the comment that all the oppressive actions, the tyranny, the fascism represented in that evil government is an EXACT thing the Tea Party wants.

Actually, the TEA Party wants the things you listed at the bottom of your post:

FREEDOM from tyranny. FREEDOM from oppression. FREEDOM to live YOUR life. FREEDOM from a corrupt government. FREEDOM to own whatever book you want. FREEDOM to love whoever you want. FREEDOM to choose whatever religion you want.....

The next one is a good one too:

In the movie, the fascist government owns the media, controlling the message the people hear. They twist facts, lie and spin the stories to benefit themselves. If this is not Fox News, I don't know what is.

C'mon man. FOX News is the exact same thing as MSNBC. They each have a blatant bias toward either the left or the right. Amazing how liberals denounce FOX when MSNBC is the EXACT SAME THING!!! Of course FOX (and MSNBC) twist facts and stories to benefit themselves. They play to their audience, getting them more viewers, and making more money. That's the point. They both employ controversial commentators (Beck, Hannity, Maddow, Sharpton, Olbermann, etc.) who twist stories and tell half truths for their audiences. It's been proven that it sells, so why change your business model? The only difference between FOX and MSNBC is that one is biased right and the other is biased left. That's it.

Oh, and the United States government does not own FOX news. Or MSNBC. Nor is there a monopoly news network; viewers get to choose what they want to watch.

And as I stated above, V for Vendetta was about a big, corrupt, controlling government with a planned economy. Not a small, limited government, which is what the TEA Party wants.

The occupy protestors block a port, disrupt the economy, and cause a lot of good people to lose money. How can this be a victory? How can disrupting a already desperate economy be a victory? Do they care about the people they are hurting? What is their real goal?

Neither my husband or I believe this way...my sister and sister-in-law are lesbians, our roommates are lesbians, and many of our other friends are also gay. So, not all Republican Boomers are the way you proclaim us to be.

So many of the posters on this thread have made such ridiculous generalizations in order to validate their own feelings. When you make these sorts of generalizations, you are no better than the people you are condemning.

McJ

So I should not generalize ALL Republicans based on the least common denominator?

Hmmmmm... Isn't that similar to generalizing all OWS protestors based on the worst, most extreme members? Or is it "ok" when YOU generalize, but not "ok" when people generalize you? How deliciously hypocritical.

Thank you for helping me prove a point. Cheers.

I think that one very positive thing coming out of the OWS movement is a hightened level of awarness of how corrupt and complicit special interests and our so-called representitives have become.

I don't think OWS is about wanting a hand-out or socialism... It's about having a level playing field, and right now the game is pretty well rigged in favor of the uber-rich and powerful.

I think the most simple solution is to take private money out of campaign finance, so that our nation's future is the 1st priority in politician's minds, not raising money.

There's a petition here that could offer a REAL solution: http://getmoneyout.com

p.s. THANK YOU to OWS and The Tea Party, and anyone else who exercises their 1st amendment rights in protest, demanding a better future from our leaders, because we CAN clearly do much better.

Not a small, limited government, which is what the TEA Party wants.

Pyrrhic

Small government you say? Small government? I wonder... what is your definition of "small". In my mind, small means less. Do you agree?

So when the Tea Party wants MORE government involved in marriage, telling people who they can and can not marry... MORE, to you, means "small"?

When the Tea Party wants MORE government involved in a woman's body, telling her what she can do with it... MORE, to you, means "small"?

When the Tea Party says the government should not tell us what to eat or put in our body (Palin criticizing Michelle Obama telling people to eat healthy), but then wants MORE government telling you what plant you can put in your body... MORE, to you, means "small"?

When the Tea Party supports the FCC telling us what words we can hear on TV, basically supporting MORE government babysitting, because parents are not personally responsible to change the channel... MORE government babysitting, to you, means "small"?

When the Tea Party pushed for a "Christian" nation, creating a national religion, arguing that this is what the founding fathers wanted... MORE government involved in religion, to you, means "small"?

You see, Pyrrhic... YOUR Tea Party is not a true movement for "small government", it is a movement for YOUR social agenda. You want smaller government in areas you do not like, and MORE government in areas you do support. You want BIGGER government in the personal lives of people, and less government in your wallet. The "smaller government" claim is simply a marketing ploy to trick people into your social agenda.

How can a party, the Tea Party, claim to support FREEDOM while pushing for MORE government in our personal lives?

Just to put things into perspective, here in the US we are all part of the 1% of the worlds wealthiest people. Even our poor have shelter, food, and clean running water. Most of our poor even have cell phones and cable TV. The OWS protesters fail to realize this! Do they understand how this happened? It is because of that same Capitalism they are protesting against!

Duane, you are absolutely correct. BTW who gave to OWS protestors the right to represent the rest of the 99%. I don't remember ever giving them my consent. So how can they claim to represent me?

I am all for change...especially with what these people are doing. However, I, like a lot of people went to school and got a degree...unlike a lot of these people that had it given to them...was never guaranteed a job, but like others I kept looking and found it.

I have to support myself. No husband...no welfare...no mommy and daddy to feed me while I sit down town and practice my "freedom of speech."

I work hard every day because I am expected to and I like my job.

I see no shame in this. If you are telling others they are fools for being responsible adults, you are the fool.

How about you get your ass out there and work...or better yet, go to school. I did it part time while working two jobs. Yes, it's expensive, and it is worth every penny, but guess what? If you are a single parent, you have a much better chance to get help for college than I ever did. I was told I could get plenty of help (and not owe anything) if I were pregnant and on welfare.

Oh, and the masks? Not cool. Seems to me they don't want to be seen...and they're creepy as hell.

Blue panther, you should be ashamed of yourself. These people are fighting for YOU. Many of the protesters are also single moms who are working. They go to their local protests when they can. Not all protesters are 24//7 protesters. I was once like you. You have a bad attitude. You think you cant end up unemployed, and then a 99er? THINK AGAIN. I went to college, paid my own way, graduated magna cum laude, worked fast food while in college, waitressed, etc. Worked my BUTT off, and have all the wear and tear on my body from years of hard physical work. Been unemployed for a very long time now. Lose your job past the age of 40, and be out of work for more than a few months and see how fast you go into the abyss. See how fast you are in poverty. I once was a proud jacka$$ like you. I had this silly idea of fair play. I worked hard, I was smart, capable. Play by the rules, and things will work out. Until they dont.... now Im P!SSED.

Smarten up, Panther. these people are fighting for you.

Putting on masks assures me that this is going to end in a spectacular blood bath at one of the venues. It's beyond time for these whiners to go back to where ever they come from.

The mask is an Icon of determination and the willingness to act against the established powers in control. Clearly a resonant messages among the 99% that the wealthy few have subverted our governing and economic systems to serve the few rather than the many.

The power in the mask is not anonymity, rather because it is being warn by so many, it is depicting a unanimity of purpose.

StrengthInNumbers & Indy-Patriot - Rather than repost, I say spot on! Though keep in mind that not all of us boomers were part of the problem and stand quite firmly with the OWS groups. There are also many Boomers/X & Y'ers who are spearheading legal fights against the corporations and government corruptors.

Allow me first to apologize for this interruption. I do, like many of you, appreciate the comforts of every day routine- the security of the familiar, the tranquility of repetition. I enjoy them as much as any bloke. But in the spirit of commemoration, thereby those important events of the past usually associated with someone's death or the end of some awful bloody struggle, a celebration of a nice holiday, I thought we could mark this November the 5th day, a day that is sadly no longer remembered, by taking some time out of our daily lives to sit down and have a little chat. There are of course those who do not want us to speak. I suspect even now, orders are being shouted into telephones, and men with guns will soon be on their way. Why? Because while the truncheon may be used in lieu of conversation, words will always retain their power. Words offer the means to meaning, and for those who will listen, the enunciation of truth. And the truth is, there is something terribly wrong with this country, isn't there? Cruelty and injustice, intolerance and oppression. And where once you had the freedom to object, to think and speak as you saw fit, you now have censors and systems of surveillance coercing your conformity and soliciting your submission. How did this happen? Who's to blame? Well certainly there are those more responsible than others, and they will be held accountable, but again truth be told, if you're looking for the guilty, you need only look into a mirror. I know why you did it. I know you were afraid. Who wouldn't be? War, terror, disease. There were a myriad of problems which conspired to corrupt your reason and rob you of your common sense. Fear got the best of you, and in your panic you turned to the now high chancellor, Adam Sutler Big Brother, international banksters and the corporate elite. He They promised you order, he they promised you peace, and all he they demanded in return was your silent, obedient consent.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dominic: What do you think will happen?
Finch: What usually happens when people without guns stand up to people with guns.

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Creedy: Die! Die! Why won't you die?... Why won't you die?
V: Beneath this mask there is more than flesh. Beneath this mask there is an idea, Mr. Creedy, and ideas are bulletproof.

and yet the protestors don't make up anywhere near 99%, so how can they call themselves the 99%?

Hey Former GOP - you are soooo "heeelarious" because you have proven my point as well...sure is fun yankin' your chain...you better get yourself a mask and get on down to the park and join the protest.

Cheers to you, to Bucko!

Former GOP -

Small government you say? Small government? I wonder... what is your definition of "small". In my mind, small means less. Do you agree?

Yes.

So when the Tea Party wants MORE government involved in marriage, telling people who they can and can not marry... MORE, to you, means "small"?

I don't agree with the TEA Party here.

When the Tea Party wants MORE government involved in a woman's body, telling her what she can do with it... MORE, to you, means "small"?

Abortion is a slippery slope indeed. Where do you define the beginning of life? After a person is pronounced dead, there is still abundant cellular life processes going on in the body. So does this mean that someone is alive upon conception as a singular cell? Or is it birth? Or is it after the first trimester? Where do you draw the line?

You see, Pyrrhic... YOUR Tea Party is not a true movement for "small government", it is a movement for YOUR social agenda. You want smaller government in areas you do not like, and MORE government in areas you do support. You want BIGGER government in the personal lives of people, and less government in your wallet. The "smaller government" claim is simply a marketing ploy to trick people into your social agenda.

It is not my party, I am not a member. I do not want bigger government in the personal lives of people, or in my wallet. I also don't have a "social agenda". I support the TEA Party's stance of economic liberty with limited, responsible government intervention. I support its stance on personal responsibility. I support its energy policy. I do not support social engineering, from the right or the left (I can't stand the religeous right). Instead, I support freedom and liberty.

You see Former GOP... There really isn't a party for people like me. What party does a person who is (by contemporary classification methods anyway) an economic and fiscal conservative yet social liberal join?

Just thought I'd stop in to point out a couple things:

1) Wearing the masks. Anonymity is freeing, why do you think people like Halloween so much? To those calling them cowards for wearing masks and whatnot, I thought I would let you know that the tea-partiers (the real ones) wore disguises - hell they even dressed up as the 'terrorist scapegoats' of the 18th Century... natives. I guess those would be illegal immigrants in today's world, eh? Anyway, it's just a cheapshot argument, and you know it.

2) Oooh, big whoop made in China, made by TW, made be whoever. What, do you expect these people not to buy anything at all? Damn near everything is made or owned by some huge corporation... ya'll are already complaining about them living in tents and not bathing.... will nothing make you happy? I bet if you found out they took your advice and started showering and used Irish Spring you'd make a big deal about the 'hypocrisy' of them using big pharma products. *facepalm*... seriously grasp for straws much? Pathetic.

3) I found a job after earning my (artsy fartsy) degree, largely in thanks to my military experience. If I was their parents I'd highly suggest they'd sign right up as well .... but I am also a strong believer in a person's right to decide on their own military service. Some people really aren't cut out for it anyway. Not only that, but not everyone can join the service - it's not the solution - nor is 'getting a McJob' as so many of you 'enlightened' folks insist.

Sure, with a degree and jobless you SHOULD be working whatever job you can get.... but for how long? How long do you expect these young kids to work their McJob without any future and unable to make ends meet while trying to pay off the debt for that college education that wasn't worth a damn anyway? They DO have a good reason to be disillusioned and angry, DECENT entry-level jobs are scarce and hard to come by..... very few viners can say they have any idea what that is like since we haven't experienced a crisis like this in a very long time. This economy is jacked up, by those in power... EVERYONE in power... the banksters, politicians, the crooked grafters... and its hitting our young the hardest, so naturally they are the angriest.

They do, because of this, speak for all of us - all of us are hurting, none more so than our youth who have a rather dire outlook for good reasons. There is no 'unified' core of purpose when essentially the OWS movement is a groaning backlash against the last several decades of corruption that has put us in this place. Nothing more specific than that.... Corruption, plain and simple.... Corruption caused this, and must be fixed.

Good luck to Warner Brothers who have the trademark on these masks. Contrary to what the article states, the first time I saw these masks used in the Occupy movement was in photos of Hong Kong and South Korea during OccupyTogether, so it's not just a western thing.

I support its stance on personal responsibility.

As I stated, the Tea Party ONLY believes in "personal responsibility" for your wallet. They do NOT believe in "personal responsibility" in regards to your personal life.

I do not support social engineering, from the right or the left (I can't stand the religeous right). Instead, I support freedom and liberty.

As do I.

What party does a person who is (by contemporary classification methods anyway) an economic and fiscal conservative yet social liberal join?

Unfortunately there is no party for this. So we are forced to choose between two different evils. Ron Paul may be the closest option, but a vote for him includes his more extreme views... and is basically a wasted vote, as he will never be elected.

So we have to decide between economic freedom, and personal freedom... but you can not have both.

Strengthinnumbers - You're getting pretty rude in your comments to bluepanther. I'm right there with bluepanther. The OWS in no way represents me, and neither of us have a bad attitude, we have the RIGHT attitude. The attitude that says we are responsible for ourselves, not the govt. I would never protest to have the govt. forgive my student loans, and I've had 5 over the course of 2 degrees and 2 private ones as well. AND, there was no job in my degree field either when I graduated. I took other jobs until I could get one in my field. And I didn't whine or complain, no one did then. It was a part of life. It is not our place to keep these kids from not having to experience real life. The sooner they step up to the personal responsibility plate, the better.

BTW - income-wise, I'm not part of the 1%, but I have the highest standard of living of my life.

@Pyrrhic - We are kindred spirits. I feel exactly the same way. Stay out of my pockets and out of my bedroom. Where is the party for that?

I took other jobs until I could get one in my field. And I didn't whine or complain, no one did then. It was a part of life. It is not our place to keep these kids from not having to experience real life.

willowbrook

I'm confused... for 2 years the right-wing has been saying that the Obama administration has not created a single job, and Obama has failed at fixing unemployment. NOW, you are saying that there are jobs, and these "kids" just need to get them.

So which is it?

Did the Obama administration create jobs, and these lazy "kids" just need to get up and get them?

Or, did Obama fail at creating jobs, thus there are no jobs for these "kids" to get?

FormerGOP - Obama's policies has hindered job growth. This is not the first time jobs have been in short supply, just as I said in my previous posts. The attitude was different then. These kids are expecting high-paying jobs in their field right out of college, and since they're not all getting them, they think they should get a pass on paying their student loan debt. This has happened over the years for others, including myself. But no one was asking the govt. for a pass on their student loan debt before now. I keep being told there are jobs out there in some areas of the country, the people are not taking them.

DUANE - Your point is spot on.

In fact, the entire "Trickle Down" economic theory has proven to be true. Money does flow from the wealthy to the poor.

The problem is that people here don't get that we all are wealthy - even the person on welfare or working at McDonalds.

I have travelled abroad. I have seen real poverty. None exists in the US.

But the people of the world have seen our free trade model make their lives several if not hundreds of times better. (If you use metrics such as hunger, access to medicine, availability of electricity, even basic things such as refrigeration).

The real reason that the income gap here has grown is because the wealthy have gotten better at not letting money trickle through their fingers like water. They invest or save more, and consume less.

But on the lower end, people don't invest or save, and in fact consume more than they even have - resulting in debt.

If they had continued to live a lifestyle of Americans in the 1960's (the American heyday), then even the poorest would have significant savings in the bank.

But instead, they bought luxuries. They bought more cars, bigger houses (middle class houses used to have 1, maybe 2 bathrooms, now they have a minimum of 2 and 4 isn't unheard of), electronics, and recurring costs of entertainment like cable/sat. and internet.

The Federal Gov't gives free cellphones with 200 free minutes a month to those who are already on the dole. Think about that. An obvious luxury is just handed out like it is a basic requirement for survival.

So people get a twisted view of what really is poverty. Instead of looking at what they have, they look at what someone else has.

Just look at China. They make so little in wages. The margins on the products are razor thin. But they are buying our debt. They are saving what little they make instead of wasting it on consumption.

In essence - they are behaving like our 1%. And it is working out well for them.

The Occupiers are simply in the stage of denial. They won't accept that luxuries are not necessities. They then look at those who can actually afford the luxuries and in their jealousy think they are the problem.

They are addicted to their entitlements.

And like any junkie, they will do anything but face the mirror. And blame the behavior of anyone but the only person they can actually control: themselves.

In complex systems there is always a hierarchy. The OWS group is finding this out as it accumulates more money. There must be someone in control and there will have to be a unifying purpose for it to continue. Anarchy is a myth, just like chaos, it does not and cannot exist in a universe governed by fundamental laws. Patterns emerge and the hierarchy is one of these patterns.

willowbrook

So millions of jobs were lost in 2008, when the recession hit and millions were laid off. Obama's policies have hindered job growth... but the jobs came back and are now available... but Obama did not help create jobs... but jobs were created... but not under Obama, even though he was in charge during the time you say they were created... for f---s sake, you are confusing.

So you ASSUME that these "kids" want high-paying jobs. I wonder where you got that assumption? I have not heard that. What I hear is that there is on average 400 applicants per one job opening. Let me guess, Fox News told you that they want "high paying jobs".

Oh, but you are "told" there are jobs in "other" parts of the country. Well, if you were "told" that, it must be true. Let's just ignore every study that talks about unemployment... let's ignore the facts, because you were "told" something.

Like you ignore the facts formerGOP? Many other posters have been dissecting your posts for their many errors and you decide you know more than me because you don't agree with me and I used the word "told."

I was "told" by way of the Internet that certain areas, States in this country have jobs that are available. I live in Ohio, a State languishing due to high taxes and bully unions, don't come here, your chances are better elsewhere.

I was also "told" by way of written and video media these kids want/EXPECT the high-paying job, FROM THEIR OWN MOUTHS.

Deflect all you want, their attitude is a big part of their problem. I have been them, having a Masters Degree and taking a minimum wage job as that was all there was at the time. I buckled down and kept trying, not giving up before I even get out of the gate.

willowbrook - GETTING rude..? Im as rude as the situation dictates, and I make no apologies for it!

Now, willowbrook - seems to me you are suffering from the same issue as panther - and that is "sense of false security".

Its all about hard work, huh? So all the professionals, all those 99ers out there - they all are out of work for failure to work hard? NO, I don't think so.

A change of fortune is the fastest way to render a drastic change in perception of the problem. Perhaps you could use a change in fortune, willowbrook.

willowbrook, another thing. Why do you think you are different than so many professionals that now find themselves sliding into poverty for lack of finding a job? Newsflash for you - I worked low-wage jobs too out of university, and I did internships as well, until I landed my first in-field position. I have a good long resume. I reiterate - you are suffering from "false sense of security".... its ok, willowbrook - the first step to a cure is to admit you are ill. I was once like you. I too thought that those nogoodnik unemployeds were bums that just weren't applying themselves... there will always be room for you here with the rest of us "poor (formerly) working slobs" if the fickle finger of fate flips you off too.

(Strengthinnumbers) Lose your job past the age of 40, and be out of work for more than a few months and see how fast you go into the abyss.

Been there just last year (@ 45 yrs old).......Did not slip into the abyss.....you only slip if you allow it to happen. I am stronger now due to the challenge I had to overcome. (Life is full of challenges....better get used to it).

these people are fighting for you.

No, No they are not. Panther, you needn't be ashamed of your viewpoint.

Study a field that is in demand, make yourself marketable. Learn a skills such as electrical, plumbing, HVAC, Auto repair. In 10 years there will be a Vacuum left as the baby boomers retire and these needs will not be met. You will be able to name your price.....These people protest because they think they have no futures, they lack the vision to see their futures.

These kids want to be able to pay thier student loans, and be able to live independantly. Many young people have to live with thier parents because the jobs they can get don't pay enough for thier student loans, rent, car and insurance. One good thing about Obamacare(or should I say Romneycare) is that my adult children are able to get back on my health insurance, otherwise they would have to do without.

strength...honey PLEASE..my attitude sucks? I love my life...I am a proud American who has had her share of setbacks and believe me, I was jobless. But I got over it. There are better ways to fight...unless, of course everyone in every town got together, it won't make a difference.

I don't blame my parents for the troubles I encountered in my life...I fight them and move on. I am stronger for it. And I would prefer someone who is actually fighting for me...show me what a difference these children have made. They think it's cool to get arrested and spout their bull@!$%# on television, then tell everyone they were abused because they were in the right.

What about the jobs and classes that they are NOT at this past few months? How many of them still have those jobs? How many have been kicked out of school?

Don't lambast me for wanting to survive. It's as bad as some of the unions out there. They would rather you NOT work to make a point. Your family is second to them.

Rediculous.

Ryan in Tx

I have travelled abroad. I have seen real poverty. None exists in the US.

You & Duane might want to get out of your houses a bit more often and travel around THIS country. I've seen enough in what little I've done that rivals many places in the world. No cell phones, (let alone coverage). Lucky to have heat in the winter, (sometimes by burning junk around the trailer.) Water from the nearest creek or dug well where rain run-off would go into it carrying whatever was in its wake, (used motor oil, animal feces, etc.). Living in squalid conditions that would make you even wonder if it were habitable. And I've seen poverty in both urban and rural areas. To say that no poverty exists in the US is arrogant blatherskite.

... Either that or someone is just trolling...

Information@msn and those of your ilk and et al .... good try... LOL

So the gen x/y ers and gen nexters, what ev (non-boomers etc) follow your advice and not vote except in the presidential election.. How is that going to change anything except maintain the status quo?

Do you realize that the same people will remain in their seats/positions whether it is at the local, city, county, state all the way to the federal level?

Many states are having elections now for local/state etc leaders.... so you are telling these folks not to vote in these elections which have more effect on their everyday lives oftentimes even more than the general election for president? Property taxes, school boards, etc anyone? LOL

Do you think that by the genx/yers (or as I call them the 'nexters') not voting that these political leaders are going to just disappear, lose their seat etc because you folks did not vote them out or to replace them with someone else?

If you folks don't vote, then the incumbent remains in place...OK

The boomers would not be in the sorry mess they are in now if they had kept their money to themselves instead of financing your education etc taking the money out of their pension plans/ house equity etc.

The boomers would not be in the mess they are in now, losing their homes, pensionfunds, 401k, IRAs, stock portfolio worth 1/4th of its previous value etc etc and having to continue to work instead of retiring as many want to... if it was not for the greed of the few and your generations and your political etc inactivity... not taking part in the political process from the city/local/state to the federal level that resulted in the fixtures and incompetent incumbents that we have in position of power now..

Think some of these career senators/representatives have a clue about the many financial instruments like derivatives etc, or about short selling and naked shorting etc, or about nuclear energy, fracking, technology etc yet they are sitting on committees that oversee these things...LOL

While you were moving around from house to house state to state the polititians at the state and local level stayed in place biding their time and making the many changes that are negatively impacting us now. These are the people who go on to the federal level/congress, the courts/judidical system.

By the way, you folk did not invent or improve the internet, the computer, the ipad, cds, vcrs and the mirad of other things that were or are in use these days.... it was those loosy goosy flower powered, sandals wearing , VW bug driving, with their tied dyed clothes, bead, bangles, spliff smoking, woodstock attending, rock and roll, alternative, reggae etc music loving, burn the bra, protesting wars and fighting for civil rights while being set upon by the police, police dogs, water cannons, lynchings etc, walking instead of riding public transportation, the sit downs on college campuses, etc etc etc.... of the past generation that has given you so much, that now you have the gall to blame them for the crap that is the country now.... when you folks are the cause of it with your lack of participation in the political process and buying into the greed of the few against the many.

Where was your lot when the country was circling the drain financially? Remember the housing bubble? That was being talked about and down played from the 2007.

Do you really think that the financial meltdown only happened in 2008 just before the election? It was known from way before that.

Why do you think that McCain chose Palin as his running mate, instead of one of the intelligent, knowledgable, non-baggaged republican females that were better suited for the ticket out there in public life and in business? Because he knew that no one (voters) in their right mind would want her as VP and thus he would not be elected president. If McCain was so interested in being president why was it that no one heard a peep out of his campaign for almost 8+ months during the democratic primary race?

Most folks could have believed that the campaign for president was between Clinton and Obama alone. The democratic primary vote decided who would be in the White House period.

What were you doing about the financial meltdown, the wars, the inequity in wealth, the resulting joblessness due to the serious outsourcing overseas of jobs which started in 2000s, the wars etc to bring it to the attention of folks of your age group etc?

Do you realize that by not participating in the political process even at the primary stage is to help limit the choice of candidates one can vote for in the general election, and not participating in other elections where people in congress and govenorship etc are elected/ re-elected is to keep the do nothing incumbents in place?

Do you realize that it was because folks like you stayed home and did not vote during the 2010 election is why we have the republican conservative teabagger dinos in control in Congress now?

Do you realize that because of this non participation in the political/voting process is why we are in the mess we are in, where the Bush era tax breaks for the wealthy/ corporation etc were continued to the detriment of the whole country?

Do you realize it is because of the non-participation of folks like you why the Gusher In the Gulf took place, the removal of rules, regulations and oversight of these various entities why there is so much pollution of the air, water, food, flat topping of mountains, the deaths in the mines, the increase of human trafficing, gun and hard illegal drugs, the lack of a public option healthcare plan, the poverty etc and the attempt to get rid of Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid and to get rid of SSI/welfare benefits for the poor etc?

And even now we continue to have the firing of police officers, firefighters, community nurses, teachers by the defunding etc that is taking place at the state and federal level.

How about the attempt at shutting down the Postal Service by requiring them to fund 70 years of retirement benefits in 10 years and pay these monies into the federal pension funds instead of into its trust fund like has already been done to Social Security?

What are you doing about all these things? How will telling gen x/yers etc to vote only in the general elections going to change these things/problems?

Now you are telling gen x/yers, nexters whateve, not to vote except in the general election... so they can be stuck with the same old same old faces/ideas/ attitudes to vote for in the general election. So where would be the change?

Do you like watching bridges, roads and cities crumble further? Do you like being jobless or the joblessness to get worse and that that college education debt is worth more than the degree you got at college?

Do you want to watch more schools close and classrooms size get larger to where the teacher has no control over the children or what they learn and more dropping out of school? Now the talk is to have kids in school do at least 2 subjects taught in the classroom to be done online...LOL

What are you lot going to do about these things?

What would be the benefit in that, except unless you really are for the status quo pretending that you are so much for the 99%ers....

The boomers and the earlier generations gave your lot a lot more than they had... and watched you folks live it up and be merry instead of turning around and helping them, you are busy trying to bash and rubbish them for their generosity and love..... that those parents and grand parents showed/ gave folks of your ilk....

It was many of those free thinking boomerites and earlier generations that made this country better ,only to hand it over to the younger generation and watch what they have worked hard for disappear into the greedy maw of those who are simply greedy, pernicious, uncontrollable, conscienceless, nasty twats, canabalistic god screaming, pretentious twits, obnoxious, selfcentered, selfish capitalists and nitwits, to the detriment of us all.....

Hold your vote and keep on holding it.... and see where that gets ya.... serfs as per usual.....

Don't get me started...... before I really get annoyed.......

BOEHNER, CANTOR, CHRISTIE, McCONNELL, PAUL RYAN, RUBIO, BACHMANN, ETC AND THE REST OF THE REPUBLICAN CONSERVATIVE TEABAGGER DINOS at the Federal and state level, WHERE ARE THE JOBS YOU PROMISED TO CREATE IF YOU WERE ELECTED OR RE-ELECTED IN 2010, AND THE BUSH/CHANEY TAX BREAKS TO THE RICH /CORPORATIONS WERE CONTINUED.... YOU WERE VOTED IN AND YOU GOT THE TAX BREAKS.....SO WHERE ARE THE JOBS ALREADY?

Spiddas -

The "poor" in the US face obesity as their number one problem.

Real poor people have been skinny since the beginning of man.

The "poor" here have electricity, and running water. As well as sewer that isn't just a ditch.

And they have access to advanced medical care. Just walk into any hospital and they treat you even if you can't pay.

Just 6 hours south of me there are plenty of people who have none of that. And lets not even talk about parts of Africa and India.

So you really can't think that anything here even begins to compare. People here choose poverty.

After all - at this very moment, a guy will sneak across the border to come here. He won't have any education or money. He won't even have the advantage of speaking the language. In a couple of days he will have work. In a couple of weeks he will be sending money back home. That is TODAY. In our country during recession. A country where produce rots in the field while citizens sit on their butts collecting welfare in sight of those fields.

.

Now for my repost. Collapse away.:

Thieves wear masks.

And what they want to steal is what is in your and my pockets.

Of course, every thief just thinks of it as redistribution of wealth.

.

And these guys are proud to buy Chinese conterfeit masks - way to support our economy.

.

But I guess when you are breaking the windows in stores and throwing rocks at police - having a mask on helps you get away with your crimes against our society.

.

It's time they occupy jailcells.

Geez...

The "poor" in the US face obesity as their number one problem.

Real poor people have been skinny since the beginning of man.

Actually, malnutrition is the number one problem. People eating government approved, one-size-fits-all junk diets that create obesity in many people doesn't help, either. {Maybe that's why you don't see many welfare recipients at "Whole Foods"...}

The "poor" here have electricity, and running water. As well as sewer that isn't just a ditch.

The ones I have met still use an outhouse, have no electricity and their running water is the nearby creek.

And they have access to advanced medical care. Just walk into any hospital and they treat you even if you can't pay.

Supposed to. But then again, those are the hospitals set up for that. Some places have two or three hospitals in town and only one accepts the "non-payers".

Thieves wear masks.

The Lone Ranger wore a mask. Zorro wore a mask. Robin Hood did not. And old Robin was the only one redistributing the (ill-gotten) "wealth". Of course, Robin Hood was only considered a criminal by the "legal" thieves in charge, and fully pardoned when the "legitimate ruler" came home.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

NOTE: In some of the riots in Greece it was reported by some of their media that several people, both participants and bystanders, observed that the rioters creating the mischief were all wearing the same footwear. The interesting thing was that is was the same footwear being worn by their police... {look it up.}

People at these events in the US need to take note of this as well....

It's not about anonymity, it's about solidarity.

Really? Because at last check, 99% of the protesters are not wearing masks. If the mask wearers wanted to stand with their brothers, they'd take them off. No, instead you would have them go buy masks to show their support. What's next, forcing them to buy tickets in order to march with you?

You know, we might want to lighten up a tad. Today is, after all, Bonfire Day in England, when families and villages and cities set up large bonfires and burn effigies of Guy Fawkes -- "The Guy." It is a fun observance with a bit of humorous irony with fireworks. I kind of think a lot of you are over thinking this.

Why not focus on the actual issue: a huge proportion of the wealth of this country is controlled by a very small group that shows absolutely no regard for the well-being of their fellow citizens,or for society that enabled them to get where they are. They don't seem to mind that their greed brought the economy to its knees and certainly show no intention of lifting a finger to help repair the damage.

Toxic; after 25 years as a laborer and the 10 operation I required just to be functioning at a drastic minimum, my body won't allow me to do any of the jobs you suggest. Once you reach my level of disability - society just casts you off. Those of us who are in my condition should have first crack at any easy jobs that exist - instead they go to perfectly healthy people looking for the easy street - that goes for both parties - look at how many post at the Vine from work - hell I can do a job like that...lmao.

Strength - you deflect too. How did you come up with this notion that I have a "false sense of security" from my previous posts? (Probably the same place where you came up with the notion BluePanther had a bad attitude.) You have no clue. You are using typical Liberal, "make personal attacks when you have no facts to back you up" strategy. Very close to going on the ignore list Strength, you will if you continue to attack. (Though I'm sure you could care less.) Don't have time for folks like you, real life and the responsibilities I have are far more important than wasting time doing this.

In actuality, willowbrook - I envy you. Because you have what I no longer have. My notion that you have a false sense of security is pretty obviously gleaned from your own words... it is from your attacks on those who are without work as "kids who need to get off their backsides". Its a horrible derisive stereotype of a wide cross section of this country that is suffering. Rarely does the media interview the others in the crowds. The older people, the laid off masses of professionals - but they ARE there. I glean my notion of a false sense of security by your words.

I want you to know something. When I go to any office - I find myself with a lump in my throat, and sometimes fighting back tears. Because I see the office workers - and they are busy, they are being productive, they are the lucky ones not cast off. And I want so much to be there with them. It is like being hungry, standing in the rain, and looking inside at a merry feast. The feasters have no time to be bothered by the poor downtrodden souls outside.

But when you find yourself suddenly outside looking in, after hundreds of resumes and a few interviews, you start to lose hope. When I was younger, there was never a problem finding work. I never went longer than a couple of months without employment. Its frightening, demoralizing, and wreaks havoc on you emotionally, let alone financially.

So willowbrook - give a thought to the reality of what is happening in this country. It is not leftist BS. It is real, and it hurts, bad.

I haven't given up - I continue to apply and call and am forever upgrading my skills. I'm no slouch. I have excellent, well-honed skills. But theres a couple of problems I can't do much about. I am over 40, and I have a YAWNING career gap now.

I do the best I can to get by. Its a constant struggle, and I will never look down my nose at those less fortunate than I am, because I am now amonst them, and if I ever get back to the middle class again, I won't forget this period of my life, and will not summarily dismiss the less fortunate as all deserving of their situations.

Don't be so complacent in your comfort.

Hope that makes some sense to you, and I think somehow, it is appropriate to remind many of you on here that you sound frighteningly familiar to me. And it saddens me. We are better than this, people.

I leave you with a passage from Dicken's "A Christmas Carol" -

'At this festive season of the year, Mr Scrooge,' said the gentleman, taking up a pen, 'it is more than usually desirable that we should make some slight provision for the Poor and destitute, who suffer greatly at the present time. Many thousands are in want of common necessaries; hundreds of thousands are in want of common comforts, sir.'

'Are there no prisons?"

'Plenty of prisons,' said the gentleman, laying down the pen again.

'And the Union workhouses.' demanded Scrooge. 'Are they still in operation?'

'Both very busy, sir.'

'Oh. I was afraid, from what you said at first, that something had occurred to stop them in their useful course,' said Scrooge. 'I'm very glad to hear it.'

'Under the impression that they scarcely furnish Christian cheer of mind or body to the multitude,' returned the gentleman, 'a few of us are endeavouring to raise a fund to buy the Poor some meat and drink, and means of warmth. We choose this time, because it is a time, of all others, when Want is keenly felt, and Abundance rejoices. What shall I put you down for?'

'Nothing!' Scrooge replied.

'You wish to be anonymous?'

'I wish to be left alone,' said Scrooge. 'Since you ask me what I wish, gentlemen, that is my answer. I don't make merry myself at Christmas and I can't afford to make idle people merry. I help to support the establishments I have mentioned-they cost enough; and those who are badly off must go there.'

'Many can't go there; and many would rather die.'

'If they would rather die,' said Scrooge, 'they had better do it, and decrease the surplus population."

@StrengthInNumbers

Thank you so much for your post. Hopefully it will enlighten those that consistently look upon the unemployed with disdain and judgement. Your situation is not unique, and I wish you the best of luck.

StrengthinNumbers - at least you didn't attack me with your latest post. But you still need to quit making assumptions concerning my thought processes. There is much more to each poster than their posts.

It is the leftest BS that has put you in the position you are in. If you want to be honest about this.....Those kids coming out of college are the greatest threat to you and me as they are the folks they are using to replace us. This has been going on for almost 20 years now. You've been lucky not to be hit with it before now. It boils down to what you are willing to do to get that next job. Are you willing to move, retrain, consider other occupations? I spent a year unemployed after the company I worked for closed. (16 years ago) It was not demoralizing, as I didn't choose to see it that way. I got a job that worked me into the job I have now, it was an odd way to get there, but the bottom line was I was willing to do something outside my degree field. (Even that job paid me more than I was making at my last job, but a low wage for those entering that field, as I had to be trained to do the job.) Now, I'm not blaming you, just giving suggestions. Here is the other part you keep glossing over in your posts....Attitude. Attitudes have changed, most dramatically in the last 10-15 years. 50-60 years ago you would never heard people protesting and asking for the things the OWS are asking for. People had more personal pride and an "I'm responsible for myself mentality." Why have these people become so dependent on the govt. giving them everything? Because the govt. kept doing this, (once again pushed by the Left) to buy votes and to silence those who could see things like trade deals was sending our manufacturing jobs out of the country. Now we have our current economy and people who have taken the childish attitude that they should have "X" standard of living and if they can't step into a job that gives them that, then the govt. should bail them out. This is not a traditional American attitude, it is one based on selfishness and greed. It is not our govt.'s responsibility to give everyone an "X" standard of living. It is their responsibility to go out and get it themselves. There are all levels of comfortable living, not necessarily based on the glitz of TV. I would like to elaborate further, but the basic premise is there. Sorry I don't have more time.

Correct - if they were businessmen they could have written off the protest as a business meeting, along with all the food, clothing and shelter. They may even get money back atthe end of the year claiming a loss of revenue.

Don't even try to say businesses aren't sucking off my tax dollars. It's all based on your own prespective.

The hypocrisy from this group is priceless.

OWS says: Corporations are bad, man! Making a profit is evil - they should give the money away to people like us instead!

OWS does: Buys Guy Fawkes masks for cheap, resells them for $5 each making a huge profit, and is then excited about how much money they are making.

OWS says: Businesses who manufacture or have factories overseas are evil! How dare they use foreign workers to make goods instead of American workers!

OWS does: Can't buy the Guy Fawkes masks here (too expensive/not legal to use per WB) so they buy the knock offs from Chinese manufacturers.

OWS says: People who work for Wall Street and corporations are evil! How dare they keep all that money they earned! They need to give us their money!

OWS does: Complain about other homeless people coming to the camp to get free food after they have worked 18 hours a day to make gourmet meals when the homeless people have not contributed to the OWS collective mindset. So they decided to stop making the gourmet meals and just hand out PB&J sandwiches to stop those "other" people from eating "their" food.

OWS says: We are a peaceful movement full of love and open hearts.

OWS does: Adopts the face of a known terrorist as their symbol, engages in violent riots, and commits a myriad of violent crimes from aggravated battery to rape.

This is what you get when you have a bunch of people who have way more energy (drugs?) than brains. Morons.

What's next, Bin Laden masks?

http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/epic-fail-guy#.TrP7OK4zm68

It's actually not based on the movie, which was made from a graphic novel. It was from a joke online known as "epic fail guy" The actual group anonymous started protesting scientology using many online memes, and this was one of them. I think there's been some spill over into occupy and folks didn't get the memo lol

How fitting...

@Coleslaw

You are the perfect example of the low-information, low-intellect American voter who facilitated the extant gross wealth inbalance in the US by voting for the "rich people's party," like a dope.

OWS has nothing to do with "hating" capitalism, evil, redistribution of wealth, or any of your other absurd claims.

You obviously have no idea what you're talking about, and are just looking for a forum to spew your filthy hate.

Elle, What do they stand for then?

army-3854635

What's next, Bin Laden masks?

If they were going to wear the mask of a terrorist, I'd think they'd choose G.W. Bush or Dick Cheney.

Get some perspective.

@coleslaw1

I dont think OWS has ever claimed any of those things, save for being a peaceful movement.

You have boiled down their grievances into a bumper sticker, where there can be no nuance or any sort of honest debate about the issue.

People like you just muddy the waters of the debate, you only ensure that nothing ever gets fixed.

YouJustSaidWhat: Fawkes was a terrorist. Did you miss that in the story? They are wearing the mask of a known terrorist, that is not even in debate.

I never said Bush and Cheney were great people or that I support what they did. I can even see your comparison. Fawkes tried to blow up the government for religious reasons, just like Bin Laden. You can even argue that Bush and Cheney used religion as an excuse to go to war with the middle east, if not directly, they did use it as a back drop to promote fear and hate towards Muslims.

But wearing the mask of any terrorist while supporting a "peaceful" movement seems counter-productive.

Elle and Zaruski - Not sure where you have been for the past six weeks but I live in NYC where the OWS movement is centered. Every night on the news they interview the OWS protesters. Every night it is the same diatribe from the mouths of the actual OWS protesters - bring down corporations, corporations are the root of all evil, rich people have too much money and need to "share" it with everyone else, etc. According to their own words, there are a few other points that OWS seems to want too (I have been keeping a written list next to the TV at night):

1. Forgiveness of all debts (sort of like the Apostles Creed of OWS)

2. Ban private ownership of land

3. Make minimum wage >$20/hr

4. Lower retirement age to 50

5. Unionize all workers

6. Legally enforce a 6 hour maximum work day

Sorry if you don't agree with the actual OWS people in Zucotti park who are saying these things. Maybe you should start your own splitter group and list your own demands (you call it the Judean People's Front)!

Elle-1709289 there are intelligent and clear ways of voicing disagreeing with someone and that was not the way. coleslaw1 expressed his opinion in a clear intelligent thought out way and your insults were not warranted.

However you did disagree with him and feel he was wrong, perhaps this is the problem with the OWS, no one knows what the message they support is. Coleslaw saw it his way you, see it another way.

I have my own opinions, which are of course my own.

The big banks got us into this? What about the people who signed up for a $600K mortgage when they earn $50K a year, come on people take some responsibility for your actions.

I'm not in the 1% but I am not sad about it jealous or think everyone in the 1% didn't work their butts off to get there.

So they want their college debt forgiven because they don't want to work.

Elle and Zaruski... you have both come on here and stated what others believe the demands of the OWS movement are incorrect. Yet, you have only stated they are incorrect without telling us what this movement does stand for. If we are no correct in believing what this movement is about, why don't you tell us what its demands are then. You tell us we are wrong but do not provide a shred of proof or even your own personal statement to say what this movement is about.

twotex: That is simplifying it a little too much. Those with degrees want to work, but they only want to work in jobs they WANT. They are unwilling to take jobs the rest of us would take. I bet they have not been to the recruiter, and I know the Army and Marines are hiring. McDonald's is probably in need of a fry cook, but that is not what they WANT. So rather than work at an undesirable job until the economy gets better, they will just protest and act like there are no jobs to be had.

Army - of course. They want you to donate money to them so they can buy pizza.

That way they don't have to take a job making the pizza.

Jobs like those are only for people like the rest of us. You know, the taxpaying workers.

The occupiers are entitled to good paying jobs.

They shouldn't have to work hard. That's for you.

.

Isn't it time we confront them for the leeches that they are? Every job must have someone to do it. We will never not need people to do the hard jobs, many that don't pay alot.

But someone has to do them.

The occupiers complain about the rich, but then they look down on those that make ends meet by doing the hard jobs.

There are only two classes in America - the Entitled, and the Those that work to pay for those entitlements.

@STLMIke

If you dont know what OWS is about, then I dont think you are really that interested in finding out.

Really, it is not that hard.

army-3854635 agree 100% with you, if people want to use their degree and can't find a job in the civilian world the military can put your degree to work, even doing a job you studied for, be it medicine, science or law.

yeah, hollyhouse-

that's why the masks look just like they did in v and nothing like the link you provided...

btw protesters- real original...

also, guy with the mask in the picture- cover up your tattoo...

Zaruski, Great! I've been waiting for you for weeks. Since its not that hard you should have no trouble articulating what OWS is all about. Both you and Elle at 2.9 and 2.6 have know trouble telling coleslaw what OWS isn't, so you must know what it is. I'm all ears, fill me in.

Elle and Zaruski - I still haven't seen your response of what you think the OWS protesters want. So for fun, here are a couple of videos from OWS and the protesters in their own words...

http://youtu.be/dnKetznvdUE

http://youtu.be/XOkMizZjhBI

http://youtu.be/Q55OAozWeNo

http://youtu.be/50rpJ7EQWuI

http://youtu.be/RDuHqntfqUI

Like I said, priceless...

Yet, you have only stated they are incorrect without telling us what this movement does stand for. If we are no correct in believing what this movement is about, why don't you tell us what its demands are then.

STLMike

Because you would not listen. You have already made your assumptions and nothing anyone says will change your mind. You have given in to the Fox News lies, you have accepted them, and you believe them to be ironclad.

Telling you what this is REALLY about is akin to telling it to a rock. I know this is true for one simple reason... if you were truly interested, you would already know. It is easy to do a simple Google search and find the answer. The fact that you do not know is proof that you are nothing more than a right-wing, Fox News parrot... repeating the lies you hear and plugging your ears to the truth.

Former, I have seen Coleslaw post what actual members of OWS claim the movement is about, multiple times in this thread alone. Elle, Zaruski, and yourself continue to say he is wrong. We have done as you asked, posted what many of us see the actual OWS members claim. Yet you continue to say we are wrong with no counter-argument. We did look it up, then posted it for you to see. Those are not FOX News links above, so please, in the interest of discussion, what do you think it stands for?

JustaGrunt:

Magnolia, well to be fair, more then likely the ones that are licensed by WB are more then likely made in China as well. I just thought that it was funny that they are protesting the decline of the middle class, by buying a product from a country that helped fuel that decline.

Oh, absolutely. I'm sure the licensed masks are made overseas as well. I'm by no means giving Time Warner a pass, but I also saw the irony there, and I'm glad I'm not the only one.

fomer-GOP I don't watch FOX news I listen to facts and see what the message is and I am still confused!

There is an assumption this magical 1% don't deserve it. I wonder why they don't serve it if they worked hard for it. Also an embarrassing fact some of the protesters belong to the 1% if taken on a global scale and with many more belong to the 10%.

I love when it replies to the wrong post... awesome. Please ignore my post, I'm going to post it to the correct thread.

Army-3854635 and Krestov-

Join the military?? Really??

First of all, what's the point of going to college and subjecting oneself to ten's of thousands (or in my case, 6-figures) of student loans if the only job out there is a military enlistment? Sheesh, I could simply forego college and just enlist, saving myself all that money and time (without earning a living, mind you!).

Second, there is no way in hell I'm going to encourage my kids to enlist in our military during a time when our children are considered expendable by our own government for the sake of war profiteering. Period. Listen, I have NO grudges against those who are serving in our military. I respect them for their diligence and sacrifice. My problem is with the people, our so-called "leaders", who think nothing of putting them in harm's way.

Did any of Bush's kids serve in combat? How about Cheney? Or what about Rumsfeld? Rice? Powell? Or our Congress- How about Pelosi's kids? Or Reid's? And let's be fair, here. Did Obama have anyone of his family members serve in Libya? ANYONE?????? DID ANY OF OUR LEADER'S CHILDREN SERVE AT ALL??

I personally have nothing against the inhabitants of Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Libya, Syria, Iran, N. Korea, or any other nation on earth. I do not wish any of these people harm, and would like to think that they do not wish to harm me either.

95% of the world's population are good people who simply want a roof over their head, enough food on the table, decent employment, and a safe, quiet place to raise their children......

....The other 5% of the world's people are the ones who desire far more than they deserve, and will actively harm others to get it. This includes our own leaders and those that stand to profit from war.

So, maybe entering the service at a time when we are at war with multiple 3rd world nations is NOT a good idea.

I'll stop my rant right there. Thanks for listening. And before you lambast me, remember, you opened this debate.

I won't lambast you, don't worry. I completely respect your opinion. I know the military is not for everyone. I also know that the vast majority of jobs in the military are non-combat roles. The Air Force has very few positions that will ever even get someone close to a combat zone (pilots, Froward Observers, etc). There are many "safe" military jobs. Jobs that on average are far safer than many manufacturing jobs.

You make a solid point that most in the military despise too. None of our important leaders today have served or have children who serve. There are some in congress, but none of the big ones as you point out. Easy to send others to an uncomfortable situation when you have no direct impact at home.

I also understand your feelings that you should not have to enlist when you took the time and did the diligence of going to college. I am college educated and the military paid my way. But right now it does agitateme when protesters say there are no jobs to be had when the military has plenty of them. Many are officer positions that those with degrees can get, and they pay very well.

I find it amusing that so many who disparage using a mask don't even put their real name on what they write.

I am79 years old, have all I need, have owned 3 successful businesses and was a naval flier, But, I support these protesters 100%. They are right that greed is destroying America and if we don't get millions in the streets America will soon be in depression and chaos. We are crazy to sit on our butts and watch lowlife pigs destroy America. I have been with the protesters and plan to be back.

Force our public owned corporations to pay our minimum wages wherever the go. This would bring back jobs and show a little regard for workers.

Make all government guaranteed loans directly for a small interest. This would reduce house notes by half or more and leave trillions in the hands of our people instead of thieving banks.

Why should anyone pay a bank 600k or more for a 200k house when the tax payer backs the loan?

There is much that could be done to improve our economy; But, it is obvious that both parties are owned or they would have acted for the people. Instead the have joined the very pigs that are destroying our country.

Indy Patriot - But someone else can do it?

Just like the jobs the occupiers don't want. Someone else can do it.

Just like the taxes the occupiers don't want to pay. Someone else can do it.

They want you to donate money so they can buy pizza. But they won't take a job making pizza.

Someone else can do it.

And since they get money from their parents or handouts from the Gov't - why wouldn't they have the luxury of not working.

And they say CEO's don't earn their money.

Does someone taking handouts earn theirs?

And who pays for the handouts?

Someone else.

Indy Patriot, I don't think you realize the difference between an officer and a enlisted man. Officers get treated way better, and get way better pay, plus benefits and respect. If you have a degree you can become an officer. No degree, enlisted is your only choice. So your degree would actually reap some benefit in the military. Also "army" was right. There are safe jobs in the military. Especially the air force. Grunts like me call it the chair force, easy breezy compared to our job. Those who find themselves in combat are those who chose a military specialty that involves combat (infantry, special forces, Navy Seals, ect...) You think the seals who went in and killed Bin-Laden were expecting to be kept out of combat. No, they joined the Seals expecting and looking for combat. Its what they wanted. Not all military personell want combat, but most expect it when they join. And if you want to stay as far from combat as possible, get a very technical job that doesn't require you deploy. Do some research, you'll see the military really does have a lot to offer. My dad was in the Air Force, but he never deployed. He was a genius and way to valuable to be put in harms way. They kept him in the states where they needed him.

Army and Krestov

Finding the worst, most extreme members of a movement is generally not a good tactic in finding the information you want. To reinforce this point, above I did the exact same thing to the Tea Party... taking the worst, most extreme members, and attributing their views to the entire movement. Hopefully people on the right understand the comparison... but that would require a certain level of empathy I am not convinced they posses.

I am not going to list everything, because you will not believe me. But I will list one demand for you... so you can shoot it down.

Remove the corrupt lobbyist money that controls our legislation. Currently, the 1% can buy legislation through lobbyists. Laws, and government legislation, should be for the benefit of ALL citizens. Allowing a ruling class to buy legislation that solely benefits them is the epitome of corruption.

Now... proceed to explain how allowing the 1%, corporations, unions, and PACs to buy elections and legislation is a GOOD thing. Or perhaps you will take the hypocritical stand-point of removing union lobbyists, but preserving corporations and the 1%. That seems to be the current Republican position.

So how did shutting down the port in Oakland, "their greatest victory", help them achieve this goal?

Former, I won't argue that point. Lobbying, in it's current form is an absolute atrocity to our system. I agree.

Lobbying would be okay of you could guarantee no lobbyist monetary support for any candidate, but that won't happen. I am all for a complete overhaul of that practice, but I will be honest, I have no good ideas on how to do that. Open to hearing them though.

And also, I am NOT a Tea Party follower. I actually am just as opposed to the most of their positions as I am OWS. I prefer the middle, where common sense can find compromise solutions that will not polarize America one way or the other.

Of course that is only one stance taken. Even though you claim the above issues are extreme fringe members, I will challenge that the vast majority of OWS is closer to those beliefs than you think.

army

Of course that is only one stance taken. Even though you claim the above issues are extreme fringe members, I will challenge that the vast majority of OWS is closer to those beliefs than you think.

Interviews with rational, logical people do not help ratings. Naturally the media swarms like flys to stench.

I agree that we should compromise to find a solution that does not polarize America. Right now, there is no one willing to compromise. So we get to choose one extreme, or the other.

Having a family member in a very high position in the air force, I am privy to the amount of money wasted due to lobbyists from companies like Boeing. It would shock people if they knew how much of our tax dollars are wasted on things we do not need. Seeing as how OWS is the only movement against the control these lobbyists have, I have to throw support behind THAT idea. Unfortunately, supporting that idea also gives support to the extreme freaks you see on the news.

@COLESLAW.......JPF........PFJ.......SPLITTERS! ROFLMAO!!!!!!!!!!!

Elle,

Sorry I got so lost in your pathetic diatribe that by the time you got to anything approaching an answer to the question you had lost all credibility.

Large segment? Out of a country of 330 million - how many OWS protesters are there??

We were never a democracy, we are a representative republic. There's a difference.

Does restoring the rule of law apply to those in Oakland rioting and burning property that does not belong to them or only to Wall Street bankers?

The problem with representing the will of the people is that there is no consensus among us people as to what our will is. Or did you just mean doing your will? Everyone that does not agree with you isn't a traitor.

I do agree though that there are probably a few investment types that need to be behind bars.

BTW, I think Rush is an idiot, never watch Fox News and was only 5 in 1960 so hadn't declared myself as a republican yet.

former GOP -

You can't buy an election.

You can buy TV ads and yard signs.

I've seen a million McDonalds ads, same with Coors and Miller Lite.

But I like Whata-Burger and Budweiser.

So all the hundreds of millions of dollars in McDonalds/Coors/Miller ads did what? Absolutely nothing.

If you see an ad and blindly follow it, and therefore can't make up your mind based on all the evidence outside the ad, then you shouldn't be voting at all.

So even if they had no ads, those same ignorant people would still be voting and deciding elections.

The problem is the voter. We have put Gov't in control of our lives, and have made personal responsibility non-existant.

Then we think those people will be able to think for themsleves.

Not a chance.

Obama will spend $1 Billion on ads and the campaign (a record for political spending) - but we will have a new President in just 1 year.

Because just enough Americans can still think for themselves.

But I would never try to silence those who wish to influence politics. That is the right of everyone with an interest in the policies that Gov't forces on us.

That includes Unions, Corporations, Individuals, Churches, Clubs, Organizations, and Political Parties.

If the Gov't is going to have it's hand in everything, then everyone has an interest in how it does that.

“A huge share of the nation's economic growth over the past 30 years has gone to the top one-hundredth of one percent, who now make an average of $27 million per household. The average income for the bottom 90 percent of us? $31,244.”

I can’t post links…that’s from an excellent piece from Mother Jones…. "It's the Inequality, Stupid,” but informative articles explaining the wealth disparity are everywhere.

A lot of you seem to think those figures arose out of legitimate functions of a “free-market” capitalism. That’s what OWS is about They did NOT. They came about after 40 years of failed economic policy, levers of political policy being rigged to favor the rich, and the recent “privatize the gains, socialize the losses” ethos on WS.

The entrenched interests will NEVER change the system voluntarily; it serves their self-interests too well. So,

“A huge share of the nation's economic growth over the past 30 years has gone to the top one-hundredth of one percent, who now make an average of $27 million per household. The average income for the bottom 90 percent of us? $31,244.”

I can’t post links…that’s from an excellent piece from Mother Jones…. It's the Inequality, Stupid,” but informative articles explaining the wealth disparity are everywhere.

A lot of you seem to think those figures arose out of legitimate functions of a “free-market” capitalism. That’s what OWS is about They did NOT. They came about after 40 years of failed economic policy, levers of political policy being rigged to favor the rich, and the recent “privatize the gains, socialize the losses” ethos on WS.

The entrenched interests (the wealthy who own the politicians and the media) will never allow the "system" to be changed voluntarily; there's too much at stake (not the least of which is their heads). So, the revolution is on.

And btw, a big wet kiss and sincere “Thanks!” to all you brilliant faux-Republicans. You’ve really done the county proud! (NOT!)

C'mon kids! You've shown your disdain for this country enough. It's time to go home and stop making life miserable for the people around you and their businesses. Sigh...

Please...

(Well, that was a pasting disaster....sorry....lol.)

Joemike

I was only 10 in 1960, yet I’ve managed to educate myself on our history, and not make a fool out of myself voting against my own best interests.

Have you seen the polls on the number of people siding with OWS? It’s a “large segment.”

You can BELIEVE in some Ayn Rand stuff if you like, but that’s not what THIS Republican Party is selling.

Those guys don’t have more than 2 brain cells to rub together between them (not that Rand did); they’re just well-funded criminal bullies backed by a whole army of corporate owned media who have no interests in doing anything “for” we the people. But they apparently have you fooled.

A republic IS a representative democracy, but that really wasn’t your point, was it. You lost the last presidential election, but you’ve conveniently arranged it so that our will has not been able to see the light of day. You just want the country run the way YOU want it.

Yes, the rule of law does apply to EVERYONE, Oakland rioters and George W. Bush and Dick Cheney. They should have been tried for war crimes (and will be if Italy gets their hands on them), and getting us into an senseless, $1 trillion war in Iraq with lies.

Glad to hear you think Rush is an idiot.

Elle,

If you could ever stop insulting people for a few minutes you might actually be interesting to talk to and there's probably more we agree about than you might think. But given that I am apparently an uneducated fool, I think we're done. Have a good evening.

Coleslaw, the Life of Brian reference was priceless....thanks! While I'm ROTFLMAO, FR has been sent. Besides, I'd like to thank you for putting in those links & giving a concise listing of what OWS wants (at least the ones in NYC). Elle & Zaruski, if you feel that Coleslaw is wrong, can you please give a concise list what in your opinion OWS is about, as you have been asked? And Elle, calling someone a traitor for not supporting OWS is using a pretty broad brush.

I would like to see common sense prevail with both OWS and the Tea Party, like Army-3854635. There are such extreme views that no one (it seems) wants to compromise. Former GOP, I have a relative who works for my state government, and he has told me plenty of stories about the waste of taxpayer dollars at the state level.

Thanks RowanMoon and Clflan! Every time I see an interview with an OWS protester, I can't help but havea little John Cleese/LOB moment! Gotta keep your humor about you while wiping off Elle's fanatic spittle. (oh, and Elle, I'm a whats her face, not a whats his face) I have to give huge credit to people like Army and Joemike for trying to keep up a logical, intelligent, calm, and on-topic dialogue in the face of such confusing vitriol. Have a good night everyone!

army-3854635

YouJustSaidWhat: Fawkes was a terrorist. Did you miss that in the story? They are wearing the mask of a known terrorist, that is not even in debate.

I never said Bush and Cheney were great people or that I support what they did. I can even see your comparison. Fawkes tried to blow up the government for religious reasons, just like Bin Laden. You can even argue that Bush and Cheney used religion as an excuse to go to war with the middle east, if not directly, they did use it as a back drop to promote fear and hate towards Muslims.

But wearing the mask of any terrorist while supporting a "peaceful" movement seems counter-productive.

... and do you think that it is the "terrorist" Fawkes that is being embraced or the message of the movie V for Vendetta -- nutshell: government needs to quit f*cking around on us?

As stated: get some perspective.

OWS is no closer to being a terrorist organization than I am voting Republican, which is to say not even f*cking remotely.

Joemike

Well, you came at me w/ "Sorry I got so lost in your pathetic diatribe..."so hugs and kisses back was probaby a Great Expectation on your part...lol.

Listen, I apologize for crashing your party, it's just that I have NO patience with stupidity (in any form). And when I see/hear grown men who are NOT CEO's (they don't spend much time posting on-line), who have no business voting Republican, buying the lies, the distortion, the obfuscation, who are falling into the trap that's been set for them - year after year - without ever seeing the pattern or the light I get very blunt, and a little crazy.

I'm a science geek, very aware of evolutionary forces, and frankly, it's scary watching white American males turn the "humans are the most intelligent creature in existence" into a myth.

If you're done with me, I can live with that. What I can't - won't ever live with - is you guys being so dumb. I will be trying to beat some sense into you until the day I die, I reckon....'cause I love ya'll...lol.

I'm clapping for Elle. Well said.

Thank you, Frank Morton. I am a 62 year old grandmother. I am doing well financially, I am not looking for a handout, I worked hard all my life until I retired comfortably. This country has given me a lot and I am grateful. I do not kid myself that the only reason I have been able to succeed is my own effort. I received a free public education, for one thing.

OWS is not about slackers who don't want to work. It is about recognizing that a very small group of ultra-wealthy people control what happens in this country. The contrast between the median wage and the wages/income of the highest groups is barbaric. We rank along with Nigeria in income equity, I think. This small group, corporate oligarchs, if you will, violate the social compact this country was built on -- fairness. This group does not believe in fairness. They believe in winner take all and devil take the hindmost.

Or more like they got it from a movie and as you said the real symbolism and back-story was not important.

Guy Fawkes was NOT "(actually known)" as Guido. You try to pretend you are so knowledgable, but give yourself away as a fraud. He was "also known as Guido Fawkes, the name he adopted while fighting for the Spanish." ALSO known, not ACTUALLY known. The remainder of what you have written is garbage. If you don't know what you are talking about then please don't bother to comment. Your comments are a waste of space and time. I can't believe that 15 others voted for your comment. Which only goes to prove that the people of Occupy Wall Street are SMARTER than the 16 of you, and doing something more worthwhile than what you have done here on this vine!!!

Hey Bruce I agree with you about the name.

However historians have pointed to the reasoning behind the attempt was to instill on the throne a Catholic monarch. So much of the comments by Chris-749391 behind the reasoning of the plot are in fact inline with current historical thinking.

Perhaps you were a little rash in your comment and your wording was unwarranted.

Krestov, I might have let it go except for the comment at the end where Chris wrote

Guido Fawkes was just the hapless soul who was left guarding the gunpowder.

which is complete BS. Guy Fawkes was a main player, conspirator and some would say hero of the movement to regain the English throne for Catholicism. "hapless soul" is pure crap from someone who really doesn't know what he/she is talking about.

As a kid growing up in Huntingdonshire, we celebrated Guy Fawkes Day, so I do know what the hell I am talking about!!!

By the by, in case it wasn't clear in my prior note, we celebrate Guy Fawkes as a hero! As do most Irish Catholics ( and English Catholics as well, few that there are.) As is well known, Guy Fawkes was the only man ever to enter Parliament with honest intentions! He wanted to blow the place up!!!

Anyone ever read Faith & Treason by Antonia Fraser, about the Gunpowder Plot? I had it in my huge stack of books to read and pulled it out to read after reading this thread.

True, violence is never the answer, but it certainly has precipitated profound changes throughout history. Our own revolution 230 years ago is an example.

However, please do not think I am refuting your post. I agree with you. I just had to share that thought.

George Washington Nov. 5th 1775

http://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/washington-condemns-guy-fawkes-festivities

Just...no. You don't even try to see in shades of grey. It's only one exetreme or the other. He bought the masks (for less than 50% of what the WB version costs) and is reselling them for beer money for him and his mates so isn't that spreading the wealth that you wanted?

To begin to compare selling masks on a corner to corporate greed is just rediculous, even in the slightest. (And while it is most likely true they are, in fact, illegal, the piece only mentions that thy were chinese-made, and purchased online)

The movement isn't about 'sharing the wealth'. Its about getting honest pay for an honest day's work without large corporations being able to throw away people as if they were merely used tissues tossed aside after a sneeze.

(Hypocrites) And your last line is just hateful and petty.

The irony is not about him selling the masks illegally...which he isn't since they are imported non-WB versions...

The irony is they are made in China. Remember China...the country where our "Job Creators" (abetted by several decades worth of their crony stooges in Congress and US Presidents) have shipped off so many millions of American jobs there by helping destroy the middle class.

I'd be willing to bet cash money the tent & sleeping bag he's sleeping in, the cooler that is holding his beer and the lawn chair he's sitting on are probably all made in China also.

Not only have the Visigoths been given the keys to the gates, they now make the keys AND the gates.

Sadly, as the wheel of history turns for all great civilzations...Et tu USA!

K Man, if he doesn't have proper permits to sell is wares, isn't that illegal?

And we know he doesn't have a proper permit because...?

It would be quite a twist if some guy gets fined for not having a vendor's license to sell under a $1000 worth of merchandise at $5 a pop - when Wall Street companies have been taken to task for BILLIONS of OTHER PEOPLE's losses, and few consequences have been meted out.

(Like, Goldman Sacs did just payout for selling securities to customers, then essentially shorting the same for themselves and making lots of money off that - they settled without accepting guilt for wrong doing.)

One generally only needs a permit to sell items retail in order for the government to assess any potential sales taxes. I believe, (and I may be wrong, of course) that a permit is only necessary if someone intends to sell goods in excess of specific amount yearly. Or, if one is to open a permanent business, they may be required to obtain a business license as per state regulations.

But to continue with your premise, wouldn't that mean that every single person on eBay should be required to obtain a license? Or what about church fairs? Community bake sales? Lawn sales?

Methinks you are barking up the wrong tree, my friend. I'm quite sure our government does not care about the petty amount of profit this young person MAY be receiving. But if they do, I would be more concerned about the government's agenda, rather than that of the young man.

@ homework. I think the only mass produced ones available are from the movie? Plus it's a cartoon.

Indy, I asked because I didn't know where the fine line is drawn not because I wished to bark up a tree. I know street vendors selling food items need a permit but didn't know about those that sell goods, such as masks.

You are correct Katie

Katie didn't watch the movie, and didn't read the article?

They were based off the movie, the movie was based on a comic book, and if you notice in the article, the comic book character was based off a terrorist/insurrectionist who tried to over through the British monarchy.

Katie doesn't read or watch movies. Wonder how Katie can type?

They are Guy Fawkes masks, courtesy of the UK. Just google Guy Fawkes.

Used to be quite a celebration back in the day. Kids would stay out all night and set huge bonfires. Don't think they allow the bonfires anymore and they've started doing a lot more at Halloween. I think Guy Fawkes day is November 1.

November 5th actually. In the movie, the character "V" uses a certain rhyme,

"Remember remember the 5th of November - Gunpowder, treason and plot. I see no reason why gunpowder treason should ever be forgot...."

[Thanks to StrengthinNumbers above in the first thread for finding that quote]

In the UK, every year children would create bonfires and effigies of Guy Fawkes and go parading around town (much like our Halloween) singing this rhyme. Courtesy of Wikipedia.....

IndyPatriot, Well, you sound like you know your Guy Fawkes better than I do so I defer to your superior knowledge. I could have sworn it was the day after Halloween but I'm not at the top of my game just now.

Yeah, it was pretty wild with the bonfires years ago, well into the 1970s--kids would take stuff from everywhere and sleep out at night, watching over their "fuel". There were battles between different camps and always other buildings that were casualties of "bonfire night".

Such a great holiday for kids............fire, destruction, battling camps, stealing each others "fuel", stealing from everywhere to have the biggest fire. Crazy stuff. All good things come to an end, I guess. Hard to believe parents ever let their kids do that stuff to begin with.

Sorry. Did the United States not also fight the king and become free. Guess we are all terrorists

One man's terrorist is another man's hero. Funny thing, no?

Actually they do speak for the majority and they would like to find a job but there are not any. Come on now, wake up and start paying attention.

Actually they "hide" behind the mask of the movie character who fought for freedom. Or did you just go striaght to the comments to complain about them rather than read?

Well, Halloween is over so the kiddies can take off their masks now.

no jon they do NOT speak for the majority according to all the recent polls

Jon they don't speak for me!

These people are becoming less and less relevant everyday.

That's strange what I've noticed in the past six months Them doing nothing but growing and expanding..

Yeah Jon... you know what you cant do while wearing a mask most of the time?

Get a job.

Took me 9 months to get one after being laid off. I didnt hang out in parks and protest... it was my job to get a job... which i looked for one daily.

@Jon

Doubtlessly, you are correct: they speak for the majority, the majority of fools and entitled brats that are the West's new breed. This is what happens when a generation of children is doted upon--a generation that confused concerts, video games, tattoos and disfiguring piercings as the foundation of a sound life. So sad that so many can believe in so little--that drinking and sleeping days away in city parks somehow brings meaning to their lives.

They do NOT speak for the majority...

You couldn't be more wrong... you don't speak for the majority.

Know the 99%:

thebiglefthook.blogspot.com/2011/11/i-am-99.html

BINGO! Hey, Genius! Yes, exactly - give everyone a job and they WILL go away! What the hell do you think is going on? If people had livable incomes and a little f#cking hope that things are beginning to get better, this protest would instantly evaporate. But, things aren't getting better. Jobs are not available. Hope is diminishing. You might just find yourself out there, too, if things get any worse. Never say never, chump.

There are jobs out there..these idiots expect to start at the top. Go flip burgers, peddle coffee at Starbucks...whatever. I had two paper routes at 11 yrs old. I worked at a gas station from 14 till 17. Worked a boat marina , construction, bartend till out of school...then bartended some more till I got a job...on the ground floor.

Spoiled rotten...had everything handed to them and now want more. Take a bath and go look for work. Your not doing anyone a favor hanging in the parks and under bridges like ....trolls

That's strange what I've noticed in the past six months Them doing nothing but growing and expanding..

That's only because every kook with a gripe about anything has joined their "cause". Those who originally had a legitimate complaint have been overwhelmed because they failed to have a clear and concise message from the beginning. When the Iranians, communists and anarchists "expand" your movement you've lost all credibility.

Apparently they do have jobs-live in nice homes average value 300k,-located in nice neighborhoods. So says the NYPD reports of those being detained.

All these spoiled brats want jobs, but not just ANY ole job. They want flex hours and a corner office making a six figure salary. Because, after all, they and their HISTORY, or ENGLISH LIT or ART or PSYCH degree deserve it.

My question to each and every one of these slackers is:

WHAT ARE YOUR SKILLS THAT WOULD MAKE YOU USEFUL TO MY COMPANY???

TruthWillBeTold2u

BS..BS...BS..... Go out and get a job like the rest of us

Good advice, so who is hiring?

Thanatos -

very few people are "given" a job. You earn it. You work for it. You promote yourself. Put yourself out there. You will fail... over and over... you will be passed up by people more qualified than you.

Amusingly enough - i was one of 20 people who were the final choices for the job i have now. The 19 other people besides me didnt get it. I did. The reward of putting yourself out there, even though you may fail... is the times where you succeed.

Not a Socialist's post is very correct:

What are your skills that would make you useful to a company? What the 99%'ers wont be putting on their resumes is "hanging around in a park complaining"

Something is wrong with some of you. These people with the masks are Europeans, protesting about European issues, with their own European background and way of thinking. They are obviously growing and whatever companies you think are hiring here are not hiring there. The problem is not about skills either, it is about lack of demand for those skills, because of a sluggish economy.

I am a receptionist and hand out job applications where I work. Every day I get 5-6 applications. We do not have any open positions, but we do have 150 applications on file. Wake up! There are not enough jobs for everyone! Those of you who say "get a job" - why don't you do something about it? Or do you just have nothing to do except spend your days posting complaints on forums?

Elsbeth - i dont need to do something about it. I have a job. This thread is about the usage of the mask though.

The company i work for has been hiring. Just because yours isnt, doesnt mean that no one is.

It's a job "hunt" or a job "search" people need to look for them.

Speaking of which... thanks for joining us complaining on these forums...

There aren't any jobs. Period, expecially for us college aged people.

I've been applying for jobs for about 2 years now, I've applied for janitorial positions, restaurants, small businesses, pizza places, grocery stores, "ditch digging", retail. ETC. I've had 3 interviews after 1 year of constant applying.

My parents always told me that if you work hard you will me rewarded. Well, here I am at 24 months of unemployment? Now what? Keep applying and living with parents? Hope that after the 10,000's application I hand in or phone call I make will warrant something? When will it get better?

Operation Wall Street wouldn't exist if there were jobs. I imagine those protesters are much like me, normal young americans (not hippies or grungy people) who cannot get hired.

Traveler: Tell your lies to the veterans that are there. The ones who fought and bled in Iraq and Afghanistan. Now they stand with us.

Tell that to the workers who got laid off who are there.

No one wants hand-outs. We want to break the power of the oligarchs and plutocrats that have stolen our democracy.

Why the hell can you people not understand this? You fools.

I have heard enough about no jobs available. There are plenty, the fact of the matter is Americans think they are too good for certain work.

Lets take a deeper look, the percentage of "kids" who actually use the degree they have earned in college is deplorable. Recent studies have shown 8-10 do not use their degree.

That's because young people in general don't have a plan or a clue what real life is. Parents over the last few decades have coddled their children to the point where they can't make decisions for themselves.

On top of that they are all used to buying possessions to feel happy instead of setting goals and accomplishing things.

This country doesn't know what happiness really is anymore. We all think it can be bought or handed to us in the form of a "change" slogan.

This movement is a prime example of the decay of personal accountability and responsibility.

For all of you who say they can't find a job, look harder or move. Life isn't easy neither are the decisions you have to make to get through it.

Actually, they are very relevant. They are becoming more and more widespread, their message is resonating with an increasingly larger audience, and they continue to make news. As far as getting a job, if there were any jobs to be had, they wouldn't be there in the first place. You are just mad because more people identify with them than they do with your precious Tea Baggers. The Occupy Movement represents the 99% of Americans who are being screwed over by the 1% of the wealthy and by large corporations. The Tea Baggers are the puppets of the one percenters.

So if there are plenty of jobs, then why after a year of me applying for retail, small business, restaurants, banks, grocery stores, and other minimum wage bottom of the ladder high school jobs like that, I am unable to get one? Or are all of these jobs in nuclear engineering?

If you live in an over crowded, underfunded State like California there is your answer.

If the people REALLY wanted to voice their anger over the lack of jobs, corporate corruption and a poor economy they would leave "Wall Street" and focus their protests at The White House!

All, too, will bear in mind this sacred principle, that though the will of the majority is in all cases to prevail, that will to be rightful must be reasonable; that the minority possess their equal rights, which equal law must protect, and to violate would be oppression.
Thomas Jefferson

This country was founded on similar principles of anonymity. For example, Benjamin Franklin chose to where a metaphorical mask in his 15 published writings of protest as Silence Dogood. The Revolutionary Army equally fought with anonymity when they opted to fight using stealthy tactics which they'd learned from the American Indians.

Think about it, the American Revolution didn't just happen over night, it developed over time and started much like this movement has. It gained momentum with escalating acts of oppression initiated against them; much likes that of the veteran soldier being injured by the police in Oakland. The fact that this many people, for this length of time, and on such a global scale, all making similar social statements, is rather remarkable, and to be completely honest, it's quite unsettling.

The King of England of then, much like our President of now, ignored, discounted, and then manhandeled these acts of insurrection as trivial and petty from a throne on high. Much like the British-Americans prior to the revolution, many of the posters herein mock and disrespect those voicing their opinions and unheard concerns. The bottom line is simply this folks those 99% with nothing to lose have the potential to cause the remaining 1% elite to lose everything they now hold near and dear; if you do not believe this, just ask the now fallen 1% of Tunisia, Egypt, and Libya.

I imagine those protesters are much like me, normal young americans (not hippies or grungy people) who cannot get hired.

Stop imagining and just look at them. The "normal young Americans" may have started this but at this point they are completely outnumbered by the hippies and grungy people.

btw- unemployment for college grads is around 5% which is below the average rate over the past 40 years. So if you've got a college education things aren't any worse right now than they've been in the past.

Oh, and bobby.

Move? What about people going to school?

And where is the money going to come from to move? If you are a college student who cannot get work and have money to not live at home where does the money come from to go move somewhere?

Oh, right, it doesn't exist.

I always find it funny how people against this always say "get a job like the rest of us".

Current statistics say that for every 1 available job there are 5 people. Clearly, we all can't just 'get a job'. Our unemployment rate is high for a reason. It's not just a people wanting to mooch.

Unemployment for people between 20-24 is 14 percent. OWS would exist if only 5% of all college grads were getting jobs. Hell I know a couple engineers who can't find jobs. Yeah, that's right, people smart enough for a math and science degree and have that king of talent can't get work. And as an undergrad I can confirm that myself and many of my peers are unable to find work even flipping burgers.

5% my ass.

BMhur,

You have to plan for it. Nothing happens over night. There are schools in other States as well. Credits transfer. Like I said life isn't easy especially if you haven't planned for it.

I do wish you luck, it's not like I want people to fail or be unhappy. Too many people have unrealistic goals. You can do it. I grew up in the ghettos of Detroit it wasn't fun but it's over now. If people can get out of Detroit, you can get out of anywhere.

Like Bobby Jones i really do wish you guys the best of luck in getting stable employment. I'm in my early 30's and have been working in finance for the past 10 years of my life (minus time spent being laid off twice). I'm supporting my two roommates, as one of them is a student in an auto mechanic school and i'm close with her family, and the other is her fiancee who is also trying to get a job and he's 21.

I'm telling him to take advantage of all of these people protesting, and look harder for a job... hopefully people will still be too busy protesting, and he'll be busy interviewing... and with less competition he can get a good job.

As of now i make barely enough to cover rent/electricity related bills (about 1k a month) as well as other bills including car payment, car insurance, gasoline, and food for the 3 of us. And it's not even like i make a bad living either... it's hard putting food on the table... i just had to replace a tire with a flat... which makes it worse... but somehow we're getting by.

It's november now, so retail companies are going to begin (or already have) seasonal hiring.

And on a totally scattered note... the company that hired me found that my experience was much more valuable than where i went to college. Being able to regurgitate information isnt everything. Sometimes it's just the matter of either who you know, or being in the right place at the right time. Networking is very important.

My intention is not to demoralize anyone, and i certainly dont look down on anyone... as i've been there. I hope you guys get something good soon. dont stop looking.

So a large group of people doesn't speak for he majority, but your single trolling post on a news comment does? Gotcha.

Bobby Jones Bia,

I concur. It seems as if many of these people are reaching the age when life begins to grind on you and are reacting as if it they themselves are the first humans to experience it.

My twenties were miserable. I had little money, a limping car and paychecks that were spent to the dime. By thirty life began to take form. By forty I could, if I wished, calmly purchase my life's wants.

When I see these people interviewed, I note that most haven't been out of high school ten years and that even if they had worked every one of those days they would still only be starting out.

LOL...For all of you who THINK you are the 99%, but AREN'T, and complain that there are no jobs, there is a GOOD reason for that. Look in your driveway, if you have one...lol..lol, or your neighbors, to see just PART of the problem. Now STOP whining like babies and expecting EVERYTHING to be given to you. And STOP wearing the mask of a terrorist, you are becoming irrelevant and losing legitimacy by your stupid actions.

As long as Americans foolishly continue to buy foreign over domestic instead of supporting what their country and they produce the collapse of this ONCE great country will continue unabated. Want jobs? Want a better economy? Want a brighter and more prosperous future? BUY AMERICAN!!! It is the ONLY way out of this mess. LEARN IT!!!

Sir/Maam I'm currently unemployed and have been for quite sometime. Always searching. I'm not looking for a handout from the government. So what is it exactly that you're trying to convey? Everyone wants success and happiness and we're all "supposed" to be given the same consideration as another when it comes to pursuing that happiness. 14 million unemployed which actually has not only an effect on that person but the family. Don't be so quick to lump people into the same category because you obviously don't speak for anyone but yourself. In order for those that "truly matter" to succeed many have to fail. Dog eat dog. This isn't the world I envision but some make these decisions not for the many but for the few. Curious........

“

These people are becoming less and less relevant everyday. They do NOT speak for the majority and they hide behind the mask of a terrorist. Go out and get a job like the rest of us.

Actually, they DO speak for the majority. Please don't throw around the word "terrorist." It's SO cliche. They are wearing the mask from the movie V for Vendetta. Obviously, you have never seen the movie, but if you had seen it, you would recognize the symbolism behind wearing the mask at the protests.

Backcountry: You just proved how easy it is to cherry pick a number, twist its meaning, and create a narrative that has no basis in fact.

From USA Today:

Last month's increase in unemployment was especially discouraging for the well-educated.

The jobless rate for Americans with at least a bachelor's degree rose to 5.1%, the highest since 1970 when records were first kept, reports the Bureau of Labor Statistics. October's 4.7% rate was up from 4.4% in September. Meanwhile, the national unemployment rate last month rose to 9.8% from 9.6%.

Joblessness among those with advanced educations probably drove the overall rate higher, as that group makes up 30% of the labor force, the single biggest sector, says Mark Zandi, chief economist of Moody's Analytics. The government's figures show there were 2.4 million unemployed people last month with bachelor's degrees and higher.

Then you said this:

So if you've got a college education things aren't any worse right now than they've been in the past.

Can you explain this discrepancy in your argument?

The problem comes in when you end up having serious health issues in your 20's when you don't have health care - then your credit is ruined - then you can't get insurance, or a job, or or or.

They want us to be indebted servants always paying taxes and interest.

So many barriers to a happy healthy life. Why?

@BMhur

Unemployment for people between 20-24 is 14 percent....

5% my ass.

Your ass seems to be where you are getting your "facts" from. Unemployment rate for youth (16-24) as of July was 18.1%.- http://bls.gov/news.release/youth.t01.htm Unemployment rate for teens(16-19) as of Aug was 24.5% -http://www.bls.gov/news.release/pdf/empsit.pdf This would call into question your 15% rate for those 20-24 since the rate for all youth, including the high rate for teenagers, at 18%. Can't find an up to date number from a reliable source specifically for the 20-24 range. Regardless, the unemployment rate for those 25 and older with a Bachelors degree or higher as of Oct 2011 is at 4.4% -http://www.bls.gov/news.release/pdf/empsit.pdf Half of the national average.

Just because there isn't a job within 30 minutes of your home doesn't mean there aren't any out there.

THEY do NOT speak for the majority, they speak for themselves. And they are wearing the mask associated with a person who tried to bomb the British Parliament, THAT makes him a terrorist and the mask is part of that. Cliche?...LOL What a joke. He was a terrorist NO matter how YOU spin it. I will NOT associate with people or a MASK that relates to that "CLICHE"...PERIOD. They lost relevancy and legitimacy by their stupid actions. I don't watch movies then use that as a way to look at life. If you want jobs then you HAVE to BUY AMERICAN. It is the ONLY way to regain what this country once was. If you want change then you HAVE to vote out the people that are ruining this country with their actions. And we can start with Mr. Obama who THINKS he can spend his way out of this while he puts us further and further in debt. Jobs HAVE to come from private companies. The government cannot employ the 9% that are out of work. That is TRUTH!!! LEARN IT!!!

Just to put things into perspective, here in the US we are all part of the 1% of the worlds wealthiest people. Even our poor have shelter, food, and clean running water. Most of our poor even have cell phones and cable TV. The OWS protesters fail to realize this! Do they understand how this happened? It is because of that same Capitalism they are protesting against!

Then you said this:

So if you've got a college education things aren't any worse right now than they've been in the past.

Can you explain this discrepancy in your argument?

What discrepancy? The unemployment rate for college graduates as of Oct is 4.4%.-http://www.bls.gov/news.release/pdf/empsit.pdf The average overall unemployment rate over the past 40 years has been higher than that. In fact only two years, over that period, has the overall rate dropped below 4.4%- http://www.bls.gov/cps/prev_yrs.htm

You can quote USA Today all you want. I'll go straight to the source for my info.

You made the point that the college grad unemployment rate is the lowest in history. It's not. The BLS links you provided don't reflect your argument. You also forget that college grad rates are much lower than the average rate because the vast majority college grads are not on unemployment. They aren't even counted.

There are 5 people looking for work, for every 1 job available.

HR people have indicated that if someone is unemployed more than six months, they are typically regarded as unemployable, because if you can't find a job in that time frame there's apparently something you're doing wrong (like fighting 4 other people for every open job).

Many stores and fast food places won't HIRE a lt of those who're looking. They're overqualified. You're more likely to be given a chance if you're considered underqualified but trainable. It's not that people feel those jobs are beneath them, or that they will only take a fancy job in a ritzy office with a 6 figure salary. It's that the employer won't bother with them. Tbh, most people I know who are looking for work would be willing to scrub toilets with a toothbrush if it meant getting off unemployment (and possibly temporary assistance and food stamps) and getting back to work.

We are not protesting capitalism. We're not protesting the wealthy. We are protesting greed and corruption. We are protesting the fact that banks received bailouts, then paid their execs (who likely contributed to the NEED for a bailout) huge bonuses. And that big oil, and many other corps. pay ridiculously miniscule percentages of taxes OR receive tax rebates--on BILLIONS OF DOLLARS income. And that Warren Buffet makes probably 50 times the annual salary of his secretary, yet pays less in taxes than she does. Do you not see ANY problem with any of this?

Many of those who are occupying are employed, retired, or students in college. I have at least two friends at Occupy Albany. One is college student. The other works odd jobs to get by.

The occupiers are not "mostly" anything except DISGUSTED. Virtually EVERY demographic is represented--gender, race/ethnicity, age, employment status, socio-economic status, political affiliations, etc. There are hippies and conformists, republicans, democrats, libertarians, socialists, communists, anarchists, and even tea partiers. There are veterans, cops, lawyers, fast food workers, medical personnel--white collars and blue collars...

Irrespective of your view of us (occupiers and all members of the 99% movement), we do speak for the majority. Because even if you SAY we don't speak for you, we are. Because you're affected by the same greed and corruption as we are. Just as all blacks were affected by the work of a few (even the ones who said that they shouldn't bother trying to make life better), just as all women reaped the rewards that the suffragette and women's rights movements bestowed (despite many of THEM opposing the movements), you will benefit from our work. You're welcome.

One last thing--if we're less relevant or irrelevant, why are the people in charge so afraid of us? The governments are trying to shut us out because we're a nuisance. Corporations aren't forbidding employees from protesting with us because they care about the employee (which by the way isn't even constitutional). They're scared of us. They're afraid of what we represent and what we want.

Those of you looking for jobs...get on Careerbuilder...I did after I lost my job and I had people calling me. Tweak it every few weeks if you are working now...try it...

Don't you have to have been employed before you can collect unemployment? Just askin"

The Army trained me to be able to put a bullet in a target from 1500 m. I also have a degree from a major university. These are my only two skills. I would prefer to become employed using the later.

yes, everything but what you like is bad and evil and should be deported.

Complaining doesn't solve anything. And complaining about other people complaining is really stupid! So what are you doing to improve the world? Or do you have nothing better to do than whine on forums.

Elsbeth: had to come back to this so much later just to say this:

What do I do to help? well Support American industry by working in and upkeeping some of the mills we have left, donate to charities, vote against what I hate about our government, and try to have a positive impact on those I interact with in the community.

That enough for you? Don't care and don't want or care about being recognized for any of it. Only listed it to show you what I do other than "whine on forums"

If you look at the supposed true reason they are out there to begin with (socialism) it makes sense that they all wear the mask. Then, they are all the same. Equals in physical appearance and all morons behind a mask.

I agree with the whole "moron" thing anyway

All men are created equal ring a bell? Why shouldn't they be out there? You say socialism like it's a bad thing, but some of us think that we have a responsibility for the well being of others around us. Do you agree with "The Golden Rule"? Do unto others... Socialism.

To Iowa Native? People that wear masks and perform deeds are cowards? What are the masked cops armed to the teeth then? They not only wear masks but use force against the unarmed. What are the cops?

Unarmed? The protesters I saw had two arms. And as far as I know, they were using their arms to throw rocks, bottles, molotov cocktails, throwing bricks into windows, and starting fires. But I guess you are not paying attention.

Why do you think the Founding Fathers worked anonymously to establish our nation?

Some of you people are walking advertisements for increased school funding. You don't even know your own American history. Amusing to think of you talking smack about Hamilton or Adams or Franklin using anonymity.

Really funny, you are. Also, this article is stupidly misleading. The mask represents a mask used by a character in a movie who was taking on an oppressive, religiously oriented regime in England.

It has nothing to do with Guy Fawkes the monarchist.

link - I would SERIOUSLY suggest you explore the meaning of socialism. In a socialist state (which the US is not and is not becoming) the government owns and controls the means of production (factories and manufacturing, utilities, healthcare). Socialism has nothing to do with "do unto others", that would be Jesus (Mark 12:31), Love your neighbor as you love yourself.

Derek, the protesters are wearing masks to hide their identity. The cops are wearing masks to protect themselves from the projectiles being thrown by the protesters. Very different.

WW2 Germany was a socialist country. Not sure Jesus would have approved.

One more Obama Flash Mob out to redistribute your money.

The OWS movement symbolizes Obama's failure as a leader of America.

Then what in bloody hell are all of you doing urinating, trashing, littering and loafing on public streets for?! Go do it on the White House lawn!

the US president is not a king. No other president had an opposing party flat out reject everything to make them fail. Obama is a Republican president of the past. The GOP has swung so far right they have become extreme. If Obama was a GOP member they would want him on Mt.Rushmore. f you cant see this it proves the problem with our society

tw1sted...appropriate post name

my screen name does not change the fact of what I say

Nope...but it does give us insight into the idiot

tw1sted - I am not trying to argue but if you think that "Obama is a Republican president of the past" then who do you suggest should be the candidate for the Democrats in 2012?

Tom. I was not trying to get in a political debate. Just more pointing out how right the country has gone. That Obama has to fight with his base to give in on demands of the right to get anything done or its just no no no.

As for Bulldog dude. Your reply shows the true idiot

I believe polling shows that if Hillary ran she'd beat Obama and the current republican candidates.

So what do you suggest if the lockouts and shutdowns are only hurting the 99%? How does one go about revolt in a peaceful manner?

I believe the Tories would've said the same thing of the uprising within the colonies. George Washington was a rebel leader, don't forget. You did take US History right?

As for OWS, are you that naive? They are protesting socialism, corporate socialism where the losses of the corporation are borne by the society while the gains are spread among the few.

Walter the way to revolt in a peaceful manner is not to hurt the 99%, the way to fix the problem is get together and vote out the people who grant bailouts and other issues. If you think lockouts and shutdowns hurt the 1% you probably believe that everyone not buying gas on a particular day will hurt oil companies.

Derek - I think you are rather naive. I took U.S. History as well as the history of other countries. Washington revolted in an era where he and fellow colonists had no voice because they were controlled by a king across the pond (i.e. no democracy). Those rebels provided a mechanism to have a voice so "revolution'' is not necessary. You should also look up the definition of socialism because I don't think you know what it is. I think you are really referring to a dictatorship where the public at large pays for the wealth of the few. Again the way to fix the problem is vote and encourage others to vote out the people doing things you don't like. If they are in fact the 99% it should be easy to accomplish voting out the offending legislators. Also you should look up the history of the fist symbol before spouting off.

you are sad. what about the civil rights movement same concept. you had crazy people in those groups as well. but they were denounce by the movement. there is no difference.

I disagree.

Limited socialism, taken to the point of providing enough for people to work, can work just fine. Sweden is a very good example of that, though they too have started taking it too far.

I'd rather pay for Socialism that allows a single mother to drop her child off at the socialist provided day-care, so she can go to work. Or socialism that guarantees the minimum wage single mother some transportation to go to work. Or socialism that provides minimal basic living circumstances, so the single mother can feel safe and secure as she continues to work for her rich employer at minumum wage instead of living off the welfare system.

Here, pure capitalism is just a form of slavery of the masses. A McDonald's owner can pay minumum wage, while owning 12 restaurants, 6 Cadilacs, and 2 Summer Homes. Meanwhile, his workers are barely meeting rent requirements, much less feeding their child at home.

I even put forth a settlement. Any employer who actually pays their employees a fair wage, with benefits such as child care and transportation, BEFORE he takes home his $1 million bonus, pays a very minimal in taxes. In fact, since the labor is what makes the company works, I say all employees should split half of the CEO's bonuses amongst themselves too.

But we all know it is about paying as little as possible for as much work as possible, despite how they are living.

Civil rights and the same concept? I guess I'm confused as to how this is the same thing. The civil rights movement was marked with much violence and killing, none of which made much of a difference in the long run. The civil rights movement was challenged through legal means and ultimately by Brown v. Board of Education and not a bunch of thugs protesting.

Colorado -- what is "limited socialism", I have never heard of the term. You point to Sweden, but then also say that they have taken it too far. The concept is a noble one, however the reality of the situation is that socialism in any form, limited or otherwise cannot work. Let me ask you a few simple questions about your example. How did the McDonald's owner become the owner of those 12 McDonalds? Do you know if he was given them or he worked his butt off making minimum wage and going to school to better himself/herself to own those McDonalds? If a worker is barely meeting rent requirements, what exactly are they doing to fix the problem or feeding children? If Mr. McDonalds doesn't have 12 stores, that would put probably 200 workers out on the street making NOTHING. That counts just his employees, that doesn't count the truckers that bring the deliveries, construction people that build the stores, the sign makers that provide the signs or the farmers that provide the food.

I worked at a chain restaurant for minimum wage and a bar in college for less than minimum wage and found it difficult to meet rent and food requirements. I did not ask for handouts and did not receive anyone. I put myself through school which I'm still paying for and I make a decent wage now. I don't have 6 Cadillacs, or two summer homes, but I could in the next 10 years. Please insinuate that somehow I'm responsible for "slavery of the masses" because I'm sucessful. The problem is that it seems that everyone wants someone else to pay for their misfortune. Get a job, education or whatever you need to better yourself and stop looking for the almighty handout. People make a choice about where they are in their lives.

@j70141 in Colorado - I think that you made a good point about socialism versus capitalism. I think that if you just had a vote that asked if they liked socialism or capitalism you would get more democrats that liked socialism and republicans who liked capitalism.

I would hope not, otherwise we're doomed.

Eh...they would all show up in fursuits today anyway...it being Friday and all.

Casual firday?

And some folks there at the protests really do need to wear one! Sheez... and ditch the dreadlocks too!

WOW...I thought they were already wearing masks..till I looked closer...It is just filth covering the faces.

I consider myself a fairly well educated person, and I am part of the 99%, however, I do not support these people (and I have been laid off and spend 5 months unemployed, I searched for a job every day).

That being said, it seems to me if they want to represent that the people are the ones with the power, they would show their faces rather than wear a mask. Assigning an actual human face to the movement would be much more effective in accomplishing that goal.

Just my opinion.

These little budding capitalist are making a killing. Because they are not paying the artist a licensing fee they are getting these makes for dimes and selling for $5. Maybe there is hope for them after all, that is if they avoid jail.

I believe this story brings out the intentions of the protest. They have obviously endorsed capitalism with this mask. But they want it illegally. An artist created this mask yet they feel they can steal the image in order to make a profit bigger than any corporation. Let's just say for the sake of argument they have a $1 in this mask-500% return. These kids are smart enough to get a better deal than a $1 so in reality it is even higher ROR.

Time for some Federal Regulators to come in and take all these illegal masks away like they do at the local Flea markets.

Time for some Federal Regulators to come in and take all these illegal masks away like they do at the local Flea markets.

Then they would all probably show up looking like the "Pools closed" guy

I guess you are at work right now stealing time from your employer?

Good one Brutis. Republican strategy to break up OWS #32: The masks are illegal.

It's a good thing people like this weren't the dominant voices during the revolution. Otherwise, we would still be a British colony with no rights.

Illegal masks: PATHETIC.

He claims that Anonymous UK has imported 1,000 copies from China, and the distribution goes "straight into the pockets of the Anonymous beer fund rather than the Warner Brothers. Much better."

Much better that the Chinese get the money than the rightful owner. Warner Brothers created that particular image of Guy Fawkes. It most likely doesn't even resemble the actual man. If it did they wouldn't have a leg to stand on so it is their unique image that they created.

Here are a few of the small things our corrupt financial and corporate systems control: Our government, our money supply, interest rates, housing, education, the commodities market and the price of oil and other essentials. That's not bad for a group that claims the have no obligation to our people or the country.

Millions in the streets before the pigs have us in depression and chaos, may be our only hope.

At first I was against these hippie kooks. But now that I understand they are against the fascist Obama regime, well I sympathize with them a little now. Obama is trying to take over every part of our lives and it's good these folks are out to stop it.