I'll be glad when we've left fossil fuels behind for good and this sort of thing doesn't happen anymore. Coal isn't any safer than oil when it comes to meeting our fuel requirements. Never mind mine collapses; thousands of coal seams are burning internationally right now and these fires last for decades, even centuries.

Unfortunately I think these two are screwed. Chances are the collapse crushed the cabin of the truck and killed them. Even if it didn't and they are trapped alive in their truck, America has a very bad track record when it comes to rescuing trapped coal miners. Unlike in Chillie, we here in America don't go to herculean lengths to save trapped miners.

Hate to be a downer on the subject, but it's true.

Apples and oranges comparison to the Chilean mining accident, which happened in a "hard rock" mine. But remember that much of the technology and efforts to free those trapped miners came for the U.S.

There is no alternative for coal. All metal works use coal, nothing else can produce the heat needed.

Coal is an ingredient in coal, the ovens used are either oxygen or electric.

kevin

Some use a electric arc furnace

Why would anyone want government regulations to interfere with mining operations?

@don97524

im not sure either, i mean, the free market will decide. just like it decided that those two guys needed to die.

really, i dont get why this is so hard to understand for liberals.

@Kevin T, This Armstrong mine produces bituminous electrical coal and not metallurgical coal that is used in coke ovens.

RIP to the miners.

@Zaruski, How did the market decide that they two men needed to die at their job instead of being killed by an unstable highwall?

@epistemologist

umm. L2 sarcasm? take your average randites, ron paul fanboys: get rid of regulations because the free market will decide, the premise being that the free market always does what is best for everyone. thus...it was best for everyone that those two guys died.

or could it be perhaps that the free market doesnt do what is best for everyone? oh no, that cant be.

ps. im not speaking specifically with respect to this article and the two men that died. i am just responding to the comment from don97524

Why would anyone want government regulations to interfere with mining operations?

KILL ALL COAL MINERS. u dirty nasty ass mother @!$%#ers..kill the earth and we all die of yur greed, u nasty ass @!$%#s

all the coal @!$%#ers need is greed.. they r so late on the oil ..1st goes coal then oil then water power..WAKE UP AMERICA

We need to get off the limited supply energy sources and advance to infinite sources like solar, wind, and geothermal. These last until either the sun burns out or the earth implodes which is not any time near like the 19th century fossil fuel sources. Another example of the mining industry lobbying efforts to prevent regulation and enforcement for the sake of profits over people. My best to the workers and their families.

Interesting j.bales.

By your comments I can assume you live in a house that generates its own electricity to run your computer, cook your own home grown food, and you have a water system that takes grey water and reuses it? Do you drive an electric car too? How about your own farm with chickens, cows and the such? We all leave a little footprint on the earth, but to wish the death of coal miners (people who have to work to make a living) and condemn them like you have, I'm interested in where you get the high and mighty attitude like that.

Personally, my husband and I are going to build a self-sufficient home the first chance we get, there is a lot out there now compared to a few decades ago, it's a step in the right direction and one I hope a lot more people will choose to do. So really J, IF you have a house and a life like that, please offer advise, I'd love it. If you don't and you're just sitting at a computer and typing hate while reaping the benefits of what coal has to offer (or even just leaving the faucet running while you brush your teeth) then you don't have any right to act so sanctimonious.

John, and isn't it frightening to hear the Republicans cry for an end to the EPA and OSHA - that they call these agencies job killers?? The outcomes of each of these agencies had made a profound improvement in our environment and workplace safety - and they actually create jobs! I have one of these as and Environmental Safety coordinator for a large corporation. I can assure everyone that without those regulations, AMerican Corporatations would not self-regulate. As you stated, greed is their god, and they would not invest or absorb the costs associated with these regulations if it were not law.

PO, what does OSHA have to do with it? All mining operations, with the exception of sales yards (material is railed or trucked to these sites) are governed by MSHA.

I have never read any article where it has been stated that the Republicans want to abolish every single regulation that pertains to the health and well being of American citizens. Why do you people continually spew that BS??

I'm praying for their safety....

Ellie Mae Clampett..... PO, IS a lib that wants to keep his lazy gov't job.. That the tax payers pay for...

@Ellie Mae Clampett

I have never read any article where it has been stated that the Republicans want to abolish every single regulation that pertains to the health and well being of American citizens.

the republicans here on earth certainly do haha. in fact, they never shut up about it. what do the republicans in your planet talk about?

Elie Mae, Maybe you don't read the news, but Republican cantidates Perry and Cain have both said after the second Republican debate that the first thing they will do if they become pressident will be to eliminate the EPA.

Just this week, John Boehner and Eric Cantor both stated that the US has never been under such an onslaught of Job -Killing Regulations as it now faces (Obviously they are forgetting the early 70's when President Nixon signed OSHA into law in 1970, and then followed with the Clean Water Act (EPA) in 1972 - you know - the ones the coal mining companies want repealed so they can allow mining tailings to wash into local streams and keep safety inspectors out of their mines. You are correct to refer to the MSHA, but here is a link that will show you the interagency agreement between the MHSA and OSHA.

http://www.osha.gov/pls/oshaweb/owadisp.show_document?p_table=MOU&p_id=222

And Ellie Mae, I do not work for the government, and I am definitely not a Lib. I have taken the Libertarian test over and over and always find that I am dead centered - a Centrist through and through

I'm the grand-daughter of a coal miner, and my heart goes out to these miners and their families! I pray for their safe return!

Amen. God bless these families and this community. Say some prayers and fight over whats better somewhere else. What a terrible loss these families and friends will experience. Our thoughts are with you all.

Agreed. My thoughts and prayers go out to those affected by this, I hope their hearts heal quickly. What a sad loss.

I don't know what kind of mining operation that is being run in that particular place, i.e., strip, deep shaft with drifts (tunnels) every 100 feet after the first 300 feet; deep shaft to a huge, underground floor. (I'm using lay person's terms here.) Let me try and answer your question about trucks in a mine. It's easy enough to see how trucks are used in strip mines, but a good many people don't know that trucks are used in deep shaft mines as well. In fact, trucks and small trains (trams) are used in almost all mines I know about. We took the machinery apart, piece by piece, and then, lowered them into deep shaft mines and reassembled them there.

I grew up in a mining family in a mining town. My grandfathers, father, and I worked in various mines. I lost 17 of my friends in a mining disaster after I left the mines. I also lost friends and family to earlier disasters as well as to lung diseases such as silicosis (black lung in coal mines). I grew up with mining disasters that go back to my childhood. I can still remember hearing the disaster whistle at the big plant when I was grade school. (You cannot imagine how frightening that whistle was--------a very loud, shrill, piercing whistle that meant miners were dead, but no one knew who or how many. We children were so frightened because we knew it might be one of our fathers, uncles, brothers, grandfathers, or friends. The community rushed to the mines waiting to hear what had happened. To this day, I find myself watching mining disasters on television no matter where on the planet they occur. Miners are forever, world-wide, brothers---no matter what language, no matter what race, or ethnic group. My thoughts and prayers go out to the miners and their families in this latest disaster.

T, I work at a mine and you are exactly right. God forbid the unforeseen ever happen because some people are not on their "toes".. That is exactly what has to happen, first and foremost every single day (being on your toes and aware of your surroundings).. It is a dangerous job, no matter if it's above ground or below. Sometimes things happen that NO ONE has control over no matter how many regulations are applied to it... Statistically and a good example is the killing of disgruntled spouses at their workplace. This number is creeping up to the back door of mining. There are risks we all take in our lives, whether it be our occupation or our vacation destinations (hiking in Afghanistan?)....

What I gathered from this article is that they were part of the blasting crew and were in the wrong place at the wrong time and perhaps the blow off pelted their vehicle and buried them?

Our site specific hazard awareness training includes explicit instructions to stay away from any "high walls". And when we are blasting, our roads are blocked and traffic is unable to even access our load-out areas... Our employees are moved to designated areas. We've had incidents where blow off rock has hit our control houses and smashed the windows out of them...

I'm praying for these miners (blasters?). I sincerely hope they are found and have barely a scratch... May God bless their families, as well!!

Mr. Jefferson thank for the info, I too know a little about mining as i live in coal country here in southern wv. The initial report clearly said they were trapped in a mine and the highwall had come down on them. The highwall is not located inside the mine.

Karl.. It's M.S.H.A. not osha, That regulates the mining industry...

Whatever Ghost..your missing the point. This Is an example of an over indulgent mining company clearly neglecting its safety obligations to its employees so they can save afew coins. You will see alot more of this if the repubs. get their way. Oh and I hope you like drinking pond scum and breathing smog. I love how Boehner said things would never really get that bad...easy for him to say coz he will be living in a sealed building with a hepa filter.

elaine.... NO SUNSHINE, or BREATH OF FRESH AIR....... your missing the point....If it was up to you, you would send these jobs to China.... So you wouldn't have too see any mine site, on your way to an OWS EVENT, or some other stupid protest...

By the way......... 99% of the stuff you touch everyday, comes from some sort of MINING.........

Karl - You are just another misinformed politically motivated zealot. You speak as though companies are rewarded for on-the-job injuries and deaths which is very far from reality. Why are you not more concerned with getting these people out alive?

GHOST

I am very interested to know how you would export jobs mining US coal to China.

don.. What I'm saying.. Is that YOU LIBS, would much rather IMPORT COAL FROM CHINA.... INTO THE UNITED STATES .....Rather than EXPORTING coal to them, hence creating JOBS FOR AMERICANS........

I don't think it's feasible to export coal overseas, or import it from overseas.

John, we export coal to countries such as Germany and Japan. So much so that our domestic buyers are in constant competition with these 2 countries.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/19/business/19coal.html?pagewanted=all

I would also like to say that as an Independent voter and a miner, I would never stand still and allow either political party to shut down MSHA, OSHA or the EPA. BUT I truly believe that they have become bloated government departments and need more regulations imposed on them....

John Bayner... It depends on the type of coal... COAL has differant B.T.U. ( British Thermal Units ) levels... I.E. Florida does import some coal from over seas, I think ( not 100% sure ) it comes from Indonesie or India. It has a very high B.T.U. value, for their manufacturing process.

I was wrong.

John Bayner.... Only a true man, can admit to that.... You Sir, have a good day...

GHOST

re: Your #8.6

You imply a false choice between importing coal from China (or some other country) or regulating worker safety in this country. Many companies are able to mine coal (or cut timber or manufacture goods or any number of other potentially dangerous activities) while at the same time minimizing employee risk. Those companies that can't manage to produce without killing or maiming workers are in the wrong line of business.

and so is your point that since it pays well then they should not have to follow safety regulations?

djb, do you work in a mine? Evidently not... My suggestion to you is to go online and google Mining Safety and Health Administration (MSHA). Their web page is a veritable treasure trough of information and guidelines.... By the way, you can also read where, who and what citations they issue on a daily basis..

this is why the right cant be in charge of anything...it always goes wrong with the right!!!!!!!

Casual.... I work in the minig industry.......... AND it's way over regulated, by our gov't..... The M.S.H.A. Code book has too meany grey areas, that democracts, can't and wont Redefine..... Read the code book.....

John - Why bring politics into a thing like this? If we are to put this nation back together we must get past the point of continually accusing one another, name calling etc. Let's just pray for the safe recovery of the minors and learn from the error, if any. Safety rules were already in place. Enough said.

John - Why bring politics into a thing like this?

Politics are already part of this, the right wants industries to regulate themselves and the left wants government regulations to insure things are safer.

But hey a few lives lost for the sake of higher profits, that's today's Capitalist.

Greed greed greed

The Republicans all want less and less regulations for business. Back in the early 1900's there were few regulations on mining. Many men were killed because of those few regulations and children as young as 8 and 9 years old were allowed to work in those "unregulated mines". Thanks to John L. Lewis and the UMWA saftey was demanded for the mines and children were no longer allowed to be used by the mine owners. Any right wing zealots on here who hate mine regulations can kiss it where the sun dont shine!!!!! Bless you John L. Lewis for all you did!!!!!!!

So you're on scene and know exactly what happened, right? Troll. Go away.

Everyone on the hill KNOWS not to park next a High Wall.......When Blasting.....

Amused.... Your the troll...Mark-3013458, speaks the truth about rules being in place.....

Good point!

no one in thr rht mnd would..i think that it hapend and u n i wld nt be there

OSHA, has no business at any MINING site.... How many times do we experienced miners have to tell you people that MINING is governed by MSHA.....

You people are biotching and complaining about something that you have no knowledge of.... PLEASE READ POST # 13, I'M BEGGING YOU....

Ellie Mae - several of you keep insisting the OSHA has nothing to do with mine safety. Again, here is a link to the interagency agreement between OSHA and MSHA.

http://www.osha.gov/pls/oshaweb/owadisp.show_document?p_table=MOU&p_id=222