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The Arabs need to stop blaming Israel for all their problems. You can only blame someone else so long, before you realize... maybe if i stopped gunning down my people (I'm looking at you Syria and Iran)
How can anyone blame Israel? They are just minding their own business on their own tiny bit of land.
It could be that the Arab governments know that their populace only understands force.
it reminds me of a quote from one of my favorite television shows ever... Farscape. " John Crichton: "It's a show of force! It's the only thing that Klingons understand!""
Come on - you can blame others for your problems for a long time. It has worked well for President Obama going on four years now...
Like while Bush was in his second term, he said that the financial crisis had a lot to do with the previous president, then he realized he was talking about himself.
Actually Clinton's repeal of the Glass Steagall Act helped set the stage for the financial bubble that followed and the collapse that ultimately resulted. Bush certainly played his part.
So it will be another war a big one.It always easy to blame somebody for the failure of the Arab regimes,and the only thing they can agree to destroy Israel. The USA does not have a foreign policy,and when Israel will realized they can trust only themselves,and they alone ,they will not go away and the new final solution coming ,the nuclear one.
I have 3 things on my Middle East wish list:
1) Things would get less "dizzy" over there.
2) Our president had shown me he knows how to handle the situation, or at the very least his multiple talking heads could speak from the same script.
3) Our President would go on a show of strength tour to the Middle east, instead of repeating the same tired appology tour there he's already done 3 times.
Oops I mean 4; I wish I believed even 1 of them would come true, maybe then my tank would'nt cost $100 to fill.
P.S. Archeim, I'm sorry to say your wish probably has less of a chance than any of mine. What would they live for, and who would be the scapegoat dejour? (probably us, oh well)
Tod... i've been trying to get my wishes more realistic... like a pony.
And yes... we're Great Satan, Israel is Little Satan... europe is somewhere in the middle. I wonder who super sized satan is?
Saudi Arabia
I have come to the realization that the Mideast will constantly complain about everything. They will use violence at every turn. If you help, they do not appreciate how you help. They will criticize the way you helped. Oil is the only thing the Mideast has to offer. But I hope we look into alternative fuels so we can just give the Mideast the finger and move on. Better world without it.
I disagree with you about the Mideast because I predict it will be the
birth of a new nation as predicted by Isaiah 66, 8 Most agree with
you, however. As you know the Mideast is a group of countries, not
a nation. See how it plays out If not now, when.? The time is ripe,
in my mind.
This whole region has been violent since the beginning of time. People who want Sharia law are people who still live in ancient times and have no idea what is going on now. They are just plain violent, power hungry fools. When they do not get their way or oppose new thinking they turn violent. It won't stop.
The whole region is in a uproar. This can either go good, or badly. I expect it to go badly and have no reason for any good coming out of all this turmoil. The whole region is a bunch of parasites and hypocrits that won't die.
What region hasn't?
Couldnt agree with you more, in a perfect world the US invests in and develops renewable alternative energy sources and the Sheikhs and princes in Saudi Arabia and whereever else can choke on their freakin oil
Unless you are referring to Israel, your belief that we are going around helping people in the Mideast is very naive. We have always acted in our best interests, and only in our best interests. Any aid we give (except to Israel) comes tied with conditions and requirements.
There are charities and other NGOs who do try to help. The US Government isn't in that business. Its job is to extend US power as far as possible, and that is what it does, very well.
Renewable alternative energy sources are, as of right now, a pipedream. They cannot even come close to meeting 10% of the world's current energy needs
The world will fight for the oil that's left, and we won't really invest the needed resources into finding alternatives until its all gone, too expensive, or no longer able to meet our energy needs.
Developing renewable energy is a great idea. In theory.
We give millions of US dollars to Hama each year as part of the truce between them and Israel. Almost every year they break the truce. So we just give them some more money.
Sorry Ralston and Christian but Bilal is right,
The only alternative energies out there that can do any good are nuclear and hydrogen. The U.S. has not built a nuclear power plant since the "China Syndrome" movie fueled our irrational fears 30 years ago, and we certainly won't build after the media frenzie in Japan, and hydrogen is years away from being viable (if at all).
There are actually still decades of oil left, but I believe all that stimulus money would have been better spent on natural gas infrastructure conversion. We have a ton of it (comparable to Saudi Arabia's oil reserves), its cheap, less polluting and less of an ecological eyesore than oil.
We could easily become less reliant on foreign oil, and stop being held hostage by Middle East "dizziness", if only we would stop demonizing every company that deals in fossil fuels, and stop playing politics and let them tap into our known resources.
I agree that different energy sources are a far off reality. Byron- I do believe our foreign policies are a huge problem. We have looked out for ourselves. But if anyone has really looked at our Constitution, we were supposed to be a secular country. Not getting into others peoples business. But I think Israel causes us nothing but trouble. The whole region is a cancer to the world. They will never change. They are not happy if there is no bloodshed. They are a area of stone age thinking. They all want to rule with a iron fist. No one can give me any reason that this whole area will become civilized. Oh by the way I fought for 3 years and I know a little more about what is truly being done there. I am all for peace but there is not going to be any peace in the region in the future.
I say the US, Canada and Mexico should form our own oil alliance. We should work to get off of the world oil trade market ASAP, and deal exclusively with North American crude. Let China and India deal with OPEC and Middle East crude and it's inherent problems . Less foreign dependence, keep our money "local", and add 100's of thousands of good paying, reliable jobs here in ths US, and we could care less what happens in the Middle East.
But for this to work, we all have to get SERIOUS about developing our own resources, as we continue to develop new technologies (no, wind and solar aren't the solution) and we have to have a government that is on the same page and does not bash entire industries and corporations and pit Americans against said industries ("big oil").
Kristian,
"I do believe our foreign policies are a huge problem. We have looked out for ourselves. But if anyone has really looked at our Constitution, we were supposed to be a secular country. Not getting into others peoples business. But I think Israel causes us nothing but trouble. The whole region is a cancer to the world. They will never change. They are not happy if there is no bloodshed. They are a area of stone age thinking."
You make two statements above that don't make any sense.
1st) What about our founding fathers writings, Declaration of Independence, or Constitution would ever lead you to believe we were founded as a "secular country"? We were clearly founded as a Christian country desiring to not have the government interfere with one's choice of denomiational leanings. Government out of religion, not religion out of government. Is it that way now? No, but please don't attempt to change the intent of those who founded this nation, its disingenuous, and false.
2nd) You portray Israel as "nothing but trouble, yet go on to describe a region that has nothing in common with Israel. What I suppose you are describing is the greater Islamic Middle East and North Africa (stone age thinking, cancer, and bloodshed). Israel is a flourishing democracy with infrastructure and governance that equals our own.
On both accounts you need to read up before making opinionated comments that are so patently false.
P.S. I am also not quite sure what secular and "staying out of other people's business" have in common.
Tod- As a country we were meant to stay out of other countries internal problems. It took us a while before joining WW1 and WW2 because those presidents understood what the founding fathers were talking about.
As for Israel. Yes they are the most human of the Mideast countries. But with all their neighbors, they are stuck in the stone age thinking. With democracy the people elect officials. In the Mideast countries they assasinate who they do not like. That was done long long ago. But Israel causes us foreign issues. Does Israel need our protection of sorts if a all out war was brought to them? Yep. Will we be held accountable by nations we are friendly with but do not like Israel? Yes. If Saudi Arabia decided to attack Israel, and we sided with Israel, do you think our relations with the Saudis would stay intact? Do you think that Israel is just a completely innocent country that does no wrong? I am not a stupid person and I do not expect everyone to agree with me. But after serving 80% of my life in that awful place, I know how we are looked at. Not because the news says it, I lived it.
"But with all their neighbors, they are stuck in the stone age thinking. With democracy the people elect officials. In the Mideast countries they assasinate who they do not like"
Again, what does that have to do with Israel? They are not in the same category, by a long shot (stone age, what are you talking about?). I'm not sure where in the Middle east you have been, but obviously it was not in Israel (I have been to both Israel and Middle East islamic countries).
We're not innocent and of course neither is Israel, but we are their allies. Saudi and many of the other countries are on the brink of having their vial dictatorships overthrown and replaced by something possibly even more vial. Our relationships with them are more due to interest (oil) than as allies.
And this:
"As a country we were meant to stay out of other countries internal problems. It took us a while before joining WW1 and WW2 because those presidents understood what the founding fathers were talking about."
Is nonsensical, we have had ups and downs concerning isolationism (we are currently heading into a period of national isolatist thought). American's always trend toward isolating themselves after a foreign war (WWII because of WWI), but to relate that to what our founding fathers penned or had in mind for our country is silly. Especially if you are relating it to secularism (no relation)?
As I said before you need to read up, you are posting like you know what you are talking about; I'm sorry, but you don't, your kinda making it up.
Israel causes the US problems point blank. I could care less about Israel since they cause my country problems by backing them. I do not think that Israel has a right to constantly break promises. I do not think Palestine should be ran by a terror group. Like I said before, the area will never change. Israel won't budge and neither will Palestine. The whole area is a problem. That I do know what I am talking about. It is obvious you are just pro Israel and that is your choice. I am not for either side so I am not one sided. Maybe you need to look at the other side for a change. I do know my country should stay away from Israel and Palestine issues. There is no good that will come out of us supporting either side.
Tod- My policy has been and will continue to be ... to be on friendly terms with, but independent of, all nations on earth. To share in the broils of none. To supply their wants, and be carriers for them all; being thoroughly convinced that it is our policy and interest to do so; and that nothing short of self-respect, and that justice which is essential to a national character, ought to involve us in war.
George Washington
I do know what I am talking about.
Unbelievable anti-Israel bias in this story.
Well, since there is an open border with Egypt, I see there is no need for any flotillas!
no steven they still have to have the flotilla, how else can they blatantly provoke israel with “humanitarian” aide (read radicals) and then scream evil when israel responds. muslims are pure, righteous and holy while america and israel are evil devils who abuse and oppress them
in international waters?
Where were they going dave? Gaza. Gaza is blockaded. They are lucky Israel didnt torpedo the ship. (and they should have after everyone was off... [who also should have been arrested])
Their intent was gaza... and to provoke.
regardless of their intent. we dont know if they were going to turn to egypt, or continue, the fact of the matter is they were attacked in international waters.
just like the liberty
"So where is the Arab movement going? I think it ultimately leads to Jerusalem. If that is for better or worse for the world remains unclear."
most of these people are calling for israel to be wiped off the face of the earth but you are "unclear" if this is for the better or worse?
It sounds like this article was written by an anti-Israeli supporter...
Radical Islam PR move if I ever saw one.
Well put. I had the same thought when I read that passage.
Actually, most of these people haven't called for wiping anyone off of anywhere. They have, in fact, said that they will honor the treaty with Israel. However, the treaty does not call for keeping the Palestinians imprisoned, so they have no obligation to help Israel make life difficult for Palestinians.
no the current government has said it will honer the treaty, the people have said they want an end to the treaty and the current government will be gone and the muslim brotherhood will be running the whole shebang by the end of the year and they most definitely have said they want to wipe israel off the face of the earth
according to a recent pew poll
54% of Egyptians want to annul the peace treaty with Israel,
compared with 36% who want to maintain it
As opposed to an Indian Summer?
Ouch.
By Ouch are you taking that as meaning anything derogatory?
There were Coptic Christians in Egypt...10% of the population. Been there longer than the Arabs. They killing them now...running them out of the country. It seems only fair that we run all the Egyptian out of our country and burn down a few of their Mosques as well.
Of course we would never do that, and that is precisely the reason it is done to us.
Yep. Coptic Christians date their presence in Egypt to the time of Jesus.
One day we will wake up and see that Washington had fed us crap for the last 50 years on immigration.
Coptic Christians are the reminder of the indigenous population of Egypt. The one that built the pyramids and buried the mummies. The one that some 3K+ years ago enslaved the Jews.
The Arabs are nothing more than occupiers who took Egypt by brute force. Isn't it time to stop the occupation, give the Copts the independence and statehood they deserve, and send the Arab occupiers back to the countries of their origin (presumably Yemen and Saudi Arabia)?
Sounds like America Anonymous User, ever thought about Native Americans. You guys have worthless lives.
Poor Wolfgar - you sure are jealous of us pitiful, worthless, stupid Americans. Come on over and have a beer, lets check out the good life.
Hey Viet Sem Fi, I'm an American as well. But I'm tired of hearing these nonsense.
And next time, change your name. Stop posing as if you are some vet. You're not.
Anonymous you are wrong, muslims have never ever EVER invaded or oppressed or murdered anyone EVER...if they did then they weren't really muslims...unless you kill one and try to bury him according to sharia law and then you are evil cause you didn't bury their muslim brother right .....but wait i thought he wasn't a muslim.... but wait the evil infidels killed one of their brothers.... but wait he was a terrorist and the muslims world hates him and say he isn't a muslim BUT he should have been given a proper muslim burial....but wait.....
In other words, the Egyptians' feelings about their Palestinian brethren can be summed up by a famous American saying...
"NOT IN MY BACK YARD!"
Cassandra, you have that right. I had the experience of working toward the implementation of the Camp David Accords, and at the time Egypt absolutely wanted no part of Gaza or the residents at that time.
Brilliant - they've got ten+ totally messed up countries with none of the citizens thriving and providing nothing of benefit to the rest of the world (except digging up the oil that was underground long before people arrived) but still, - their way is the best and it must be imposed upon the one country in the neighborhood that isn't ruled by backward thugs.
Hahaha well put! I have only one hope and that is that at some point in there future the younger generation will embrace democracy and try to become productive members of the world, try to feed and support themselves, get away from radicalism and go to work, but in all honesty we haven't even gotten it completely right yet, we are having enough trouble here in the US with our own young generation and and our older generation and our job market and.....still, the best way would be democracies in the middle east!
This is just the beginning of the "spring of change" in the Middle East. As shown here, Middle East nations suffer from the most repressive governments of any region in the world with the least political and civil rights and this article should help in determining which nations will be moving toward democracy:
http://viableopposition.blogspot.com/2011/02/defining-and-quantifying-freedom-in.html
Hey Cathy, Breakout your Bhurka, stop shaving and go become a chattel, used by men and having no power, ask your husband if you can go out then have to be accompanied by a male relative!See haw your stupid support for this crap will embolden them to have Sharia law in the U.S. We will then have our own Palestine in all the Moslem Ghettoes here. Dont forget also breed every 9 months, 10-15 kids leave you a raddled old hulk.
They certainly don't. By my estimation, Sub-Saharan Africa is by far #1, with South and Central America coming in #2, and the Middle East #3.
There are other differentiators. Like the fact that the Middle east has black gold and lots of it. And the fact that the people of the middle east have not yet been subdued like those of Africa and the Americas.
They do not know how to do anything but kill and hate unfortunately, as we are all Gods children unless you speak to them. They feel God hates everyone he created but them and Killing and terror is what Their God represents. Nice and then they blame us for being savages! They will never change.
So a shake up in the middle east....Does that mean that the various countries over there are going to start treating people fairly? Will all people have equal rights, especially women? Will people be able to practice whatever religion they want to (not sure why they'd want any religion at all but if they do, they should have their choice)? Will people be free? If the answer to any of these questions is no, then the middle east will continue to be a horrible place in the world.
recent pew poll in egypt
believe that having Islam’s influence in government is a good thing - 85%
believe in stoning people who commit adultery - 82%
believe in whipping/cutting off hands for theft and robbery - 77%
believe death for people who leave islam – 84%
Rebellion and change are in the air in the Middle East.
Now is a good time, for USA to do something pragmatic.
Stay out of the battles. We don't know who will win. The sides are not even homogeneous.
Don't assume there is anything "general" happening. Don't assume, any country's rebellion is the same as any other.
And most of all, be prepared to immediately gain the favor of the winners. Country by country.
Take a time out from using words like ragheads, savages. Put your bigotry on hold for awhile. I know this might kill you, button your bigot lips. You can resume your hatred after we have aligned with whomever prevails in each country.
Open the laurels to Arabs and Islam.
Unfortunately the US can't keep our nose out of other people's business. I wouldn't be surprised to see us side with "revolutionaries" in two different countries only to have those to groups go to war against each other so we'd be fighting ourselves.
Imagine the President and others in Washington trying to explain that.
Andrew, I think that is a distinct possibility if we are not careful.
Having lived in the ME, off and on, since the 50's, this writer really "gets it". I just hope he is correct about the role of Radical Islam when the dust settles in all those countries, because I really fear the opposite!
then how does he "get" it?
I cannot even begin to understand what growing up in that part of the world must be like.
Mr. Engel disqualifies himself as an expert in his very opening remarks. Gazans can enter Israel only on "rare occasions"? Balderdash! There is constants traffic at the border crossings as workers go to their jobs in Israel and patients go to get medical treatment at Israeli hospitals - usually for free!
It is also interesting that he seems to continue to reference the Goldstone report, a document already disowned by its primary author.
This kind of blind-eyed reportage in Gaza tells us more about the prejudices of the reporter than the situationon the ground.
As to Egypt's future, it is written in the ashes of the Coptic Church burned by Islamic radicals last week. How sad for the Egyptian people, how disappointing to those of us who had high hopes.
Yes, this article is overly optimistic, but Richard Engle is a professional journalist in the truest sense of the word. He writes with great clarity and backs up the things he says. He doesn't make the claim that he knows what is going to happen.
I wish there were more journalists like him instead of the incessant punditry so common today. I always learn something from his articles instead of getting the same talking points over and over.
I'm not familiar with Mr. Engels, but on the basis of this article I can't agree with you. I did not find it to be written "with great clarity." I thought it was rather poorly-written, and more importantly, I thought it reflected the author's strong bias.
To each is own, I suppose.
Yes, a bias towards thinking of the Arabs as people with aspirations. How terrible. He must be really poorly educated if he sympathizes with Arabs.
yes we are all terrible to deny the arab people their aspirations to murder us
Some good comments here. The Arabs I know are hard working and intelligent. But they have had the benefit of living in the west and in an open and nurturing society. One thing that appears unclear is whether Islam suppresses creativity. Things used in Tahir such as Twitter, Facebook, the internet, cellular radio etc. were invented by western civilization. Nothing has really been created in the Arab world since numbers (which I admit is a huge contribution) I hope that a free and open world will open for Islam. But it wont if they permit radicals to hijack their societies. Burning churches, raping reporters and bombing synagogues is not a hopeful start. If they try to go to war with Isreal they will be hastening Armegeddon.
The writer is delusional. "Arab regimes failed to stand up to Israel"?? Hello!!! Arab countries never stop attacking Israel. Does this man read the paper?
"Hamas rocket attacks "triggered" Israel's Gaza incursion" Don't you mean PROVOKED Israel to defend itself?
And he doesn't think Islamic radicals are taking over ...when in recent history have they NOT taken over?? Can he name one country that's moved back from Islamic radicalism??? (I sure can't)
It's all about the Money......nothing more nothing less.
Which all religion is at the base of. Just like the Tower of Babylon.
The Middle East is dangerously close to becoming more fanatical. More death, more killing etc..... Doe anybody really think the world will be a better place by enabling Hamas to be equipped with weapons more easily? The Muslim Brotherhood, look them up and ask yourself if you'd like them directing Middle East policy.
hamas is headquartered in syria which is ruled by iran which rules hezbollah which rules lebanon and now egypt has joined the iran train
Free speach. Free elections. Freedom of assembly. Equal rights for all. Term limits for Presidents. All of these things are necessary for peace and prosperity. The younger educated classes in the middle east have discovered this, evidently. That is a hopeful sign. I hope they can democratize themselves and move away from radical, tribalism, and hatred. Life can be so much better for their societies when they stop focusing on hating everybody else.
these young people have no organization and no funding...the muslim brotherhood is organized and funded by iran...want to make a bet on who will be running the show?
Good article Richard.
The US, Britain, Russia and China should draw up defendable borders for Israel and then police those borders- both ways. Then take away the nuclear weapons from unstable countries like N Korea, Iran and Pakistan. Let the unstable countries have at each other with conventional weapons until they settle their ethnic/religious differences- if ever. I don't care if the Taliban take over Afghan - but any hint of nuclear development shoud be immediately distroyed.
the mighty UN already do this but them darn pesky rockets still get in there and weapons they just miserly appear out of thin air while the UN is looking on, great job the UN is doing over there to keep the peasce , look who running the UN enough said have a good day
wait.... give israel defend-able borders... then take away everyones weapons but theirs.... this a country that sinks our ships.... are you serious?
What ship did Israel sink?
I am not anti-Israel, but I'm certainly not buying the sugar coated B.S. pill they try to feed us about how they're innoccent victims of evil arab terrorists.
Israel's treatment of the Palastinians is like a cat playing with a mouse. The thing is that if enough mice get together that cat is in trouble.
If the revolutions in the Middle East lead to enough anti-Isreal regimes Holy Hell will be unleashed in the Holy Land.
USS Liberty on July 25th, 2008 off the coast of Lebanon. "By Mistake".
The Liberty was not sunk. It was attacked in error during the Six Day War.
You're right. Pro, I had the date of the article that was written.
sorry yes it was not sunk, attacked in error hundreds of times while proudly flying the american flag
"attacked hundreds of times". Jeeszuz dave...who let you out to play again?
My best pal in the 6th grade had a brother serving on the liberty. I read (1968) the letters describing the attack and that they (the sailors) were at the mercy of the CIA or NSA who were believed to be on board. No animosity toward Israel only resentment that their superiors plunged them into that situation presumably to assure that Israel had at least one hand tied behind its back.
igor, a gunshot is an attack, the liberty was shot at hundreds of times. look at the pictures, count the holes.
i thought you didnt have any friends. i knew of a man on the liberty, his feet burned off from the fire on deck, as did his ears, eyes and hands. he died about 10 years ago and lived his life in solitude thanks to the murding bastards.
so who were they at the mercy of? be real igor, its israel.
Be real?
They were at the mercy of their commanding officers to meddle in the middle of a war zone
My post was to suggest that in your eagerness to diss Israel; to the near total exclusion to anything else much much worse, you get it wrong...
I have no friends? Drop on by sometime. Im only a short drive from Olympia. I'll introduce you to a bunch of 'em We can head over for a Stamish where you can clarify that WASP thing.
i have nothing to clarify with you there igor
thats probably true. you got nothing.
and that is a whole lot more than you got
The Muslim Brotherhood a loving . caring want to get along with everyone this is plain HOG WASH they want sierra law through the world and eliminated the Jews, christen,and infidels that get in there way,as for Egypt tics tics tics Iran and don't look now but Turkey want to be the the Big Boys in the neighbour yes we went in and destroyed a large army in the gulf war and now were destroying with U.N. DA mandate help Libya army why the Muslim Brotherhood want ISRAEL off the map who many of those other clown said the same crap ISRAEL I will fly my flag on May,15 in support of your Nation that even the USA want to split up GOD help us all have a good day
WOW, this guy sounds anti American, just like Hanoi Jane Fonda, It is all Israel and the U.S.' fault, nevermind the Arabs attacked Israel and Arab Governments continue to boost hateful propaganda against Israel to deflect public opinion from their own failures much as Obama uses class warfare to obscure the destruction of the Constitution by his Administration. The fact that these Arabs have sucked on the U.S. Tit for decades and always look to us for stability is totally unmentioned, oh, well! Barack will give him a White House reception, just like the disgusting creeps like Common.