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In recent history the area called Palestine includes the territories of present day Israel and Jordan (see map above. For earlier history of the term see article). From 1517 to 1917 most of this area remained under the rule of the Ottoman Empire.
Ottoman Empire was dissolved at the end of World War I. Its successor, modern republic of Turkey, transferred Palestine to British Empire control under the Lausanne agreement that followed WW I.
In 1917 Great Britain issued the Balfour Declaration for "the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people". In 1922 Britain allocated nearly 80% of Palestine to Transjordan. Thus, Jordan covers the majority of the land of Palestine under British Mandate. Jordan also includes the majority of the Arabs who lived there. In other words, Jordan is the Arab portion of Palestine.
The residents of Palestine are called "Palestinians". Since Palestine includes both modern day Israel and Jordan both Arab and Jewish residents of this area were referred to as "Palestinians".
It was only after the Jews re-inhabited their historic homeland of Judea and Samaria (today known as the west bank), that the myth of an Arab Palestinian nation was created and marketed worldwide. Jews come from Judea, not Palestinians. There is no language known as Palestinian, or any Palestinian culture distinct from that of all the Arabs in the area. There has never been a land known as Palestine governed by Palestinians. "Palestinians" are Arabs indistinguishable from Arabs throughout the Middle East. The great majority of Arabs in greater Palestine and Israel share the same culture, language and religion.
Much of the Arab population in this area actually migrated into Israel and Judea and Samaria from the surrounding Arab countries in the past 100 years. The rebirth of Israel was accompanied by economic prosperity for the region. Arabs migrated to this area to find employment and enjoy the higher standard of living. In documents not more than hundred years, the area is described as a scarcely populated region. Jews by far were the majority in Jerusalem over the small Arab minority. Until the Oslo agreement the major source of income for Arab residents was employment in the Israeli sector. To this day, many Arabs try to migrate into Israel with various deceptions to become a citizen of Israel.
Even the Chairman of the Palestinian Authority, Arafat himself, is not a "Palestinian". He was born in Egypt. The famous "Palestinian covenant" states that Palestinians are "an integral part of the Arab nation" -- a nation which is blessed with a sparsely populated land mass 660 times the size of tiny Israel (Judea, Samaria and Gaza included).
All attempts to claim Arab sovereignty over Israel of today, should be seen with their real intention: The destruction of Israel as a Jewish state and the only bulwark of the Judeo-Christian Western civilization in the Middle East
The Arab population in this area actually has been living there for centuries.
Sure, many of them blond hair, blue eyed Jews from Russia, Poland, or the United States. And how could they re-inhabit the land that was already populated ?
Anyway, nice attempt at pro-Israeli propaganda, dov.
Well-written and factual post. Unfortunately, the usual gang of anti-Israel morons will post some nonsense stating some false "facts". It's like beating your head against the wall, true historical facts have been flushed down the toilet and replaced by hideous distortions, courtesy of the "BDS" (Boycott-Divest-Sanctions) gang.
Biblical Period
According to the biblical account, much of which is impossible to verify in the archaeological record until late in the monarchial period, Jewish history begins with the patriarchs Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, who considered Canaan (an area comprising present-day Israel and the West Bank) their home. Their history continues in Goshen, NE Egypt, where they settled as agriculturists many centuries before the Christian era. Under Ramses II the Jews were severely persecuted and, finally, Moses led them out of Egypt; at Mt. Sinai he delivered to them the Ten Commandments.
Many years of wandering in desert wildernesses followed before the Israelites conquered Canaan. Saul became the first king. Initially successful against the Philistines, he was finally defeated at Gilboa. David, of the tribe of Judah, ruled, conquered the enemies of the Jews, expanded his territory across the Jordan River, and brought prosperity and peace to his people. The reign of his son Solomon, who built the first Temple, was the last before a period of disruption. The tribes of the north formed the kingdom of Israel; those of the south formed the smaller but more strongly united kingdom of Judah.
In 722 B.C., Sargon II captured Samaria, capital of Israel, and most of the Israelites (the lost tribes) were exiled. Judah passed under Assyrian domination, then under Egyptian, and in 586 B.C., under Babylonian, when the Temple was destroyed and the people were exiled until their return was permitted by Cyrus the Great (538 B.C.). The rebuilding of the Temple was completed in 516 B.C. The Jews remained a strong religious group during the period of Hellenism, but regained political independence only under the Maccabees. A rebellion, led by Bar Kokba against the Romans in the 2d cent. A.D., ended in defeat. In 63 B.C. Rome conquered Palestine, and the second Temple was destroyed in A.D. 70.
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The Columbia Electronic Encyclopedia, 6th ed. Copyright © 2007, Columbia University Press. All rights reserved.
Read more: Jews: Biblical Period — Infoplease.com http://www.infoplease.com/ce6/society/A0859039.html#ixzz14tEc2vJz
AS an Addition to this quote coins have been found in the ancient city of David from the time of Hizkiyahu, A King during the first Temple.
Further archeological finds in the city of David have verified stories from the Bible
MORE HISTORY
History
Ancient Palestine
The earliest known inhabitants of Palestine were of the same group as the Neanderthal inhabitants of Europe. By the 4th millennium B.C. Palestine was inhabited by herders and farmers. It was in the 3d millennium that most of the towns known in historical times came into existence. They became centers of trade for Egyptian and Babylonian goods. During the 2d millennium, Palestine was ruled by the Hyksos and by the Egyptians. Toward the end of this period Moses led the Hebrew people (see Jews) out of Egypt, across the Sinai, and into Palestine.
Around 1200 B.C., the Philistines (“Sea Peoples”) invaded the southern coastland and established a powerful kingdom (see Philistia). The Hebrews were subject to the Philistines until c.1000 B.C., when an independent Hebrew kingdom was established under Saul, who was succeeded by David and then by Solomon. After the expansionist reign of Solomon (c.950 B.C.), the kingdom broke up into two states, Israel, with its capital at Samaria, and Judah, under the house of David, with its capital at Jerusalem. The two kingdoms were later conquered by expanding Mesopotamian states, Israel by Assyria (c.720 B.C.) and Judah by Babylonia (586 B.C.).
In 539 B.C. the Persians conquered the Babylonians. The Jewish Temple, destroyed by the Babylonians, was rebuilt (516 B.C.). Under Persian rule Palestine enjoyed considerable autonomy. Alexander the Great of Macedon, conquered Palestine in 333 B.C. His successors, the Ptolemies and Seleucids, contested for Palestine. The attempt of the Seleucid Antiochus IV (Antiochus Epiphanes) to impose Hellenism brought a Jewish revolt under the Maccabees, who set up a new Jewish state in 142 B.C. The state lasted until 63 B.C., when Pompey conquered Palestine for Rome.
Christianity and Islam
Palestine at the time of Jesus was ruled by puppet kings of the Romans, the Herods (see Herod). When the Jews revolted in A.D. 66, the Romans destroyed the Temple (A.D. 70). Another revolt between A.D. 132 and 135 was also suppressed (see Bar Kokba, Simon), Jericho and Bethlehem were destroyed, and the Jews were barred from Jerusalem. When Emperor Constantine converted to Christianity (312), Palestine became a center of Christian pilgrimage, and many Jews left the region. Palestine over the next few centuries generally enjoyed peace and prosperity until it was conquered in 614 by the Persians. It was recovered briefly by the Byzantine Romans, but fell to the Muslim Arabs under caliph Umar by the year 640.
At this time (during the Umayyad rule), the importance of Palestine as a holy place for Muslims was emphasized, and in 691 the Dome of the Rock was erected on the site of the Temple of Solomon, which is claimed by Muslims to have been the halting station of Muhammad on his journey to heaven. Close to the Dome, the Aqsa mosque was built. In 750, Palestine passed to the Abbasid caliphate, and this period was marked by unrest between factions that favored the Umayyads and those who preferred the new rulers.
In the 9th cent., Palestine was conquered by the Fatimid dynasty, which had risen to power in North Africa. The Fatimids had many enemies—the Seljuks, Karmatians, Byzantines, and Bedouins—and Palestine became a battlefield. Under the Fatimid caliph al Hakim (996–1021), the Christians and Jews were harshly suppressed, and many churches were destroyed. In 1099, Palestine was captured by the Crusaders (see Crusades), who established the Latin Kingdom of Jerusalem. The Crusaders were defeated by Saladin at the battle of Hittin (1187), and the Latin Kingdom was ended; they were finally driven out of Palestine by the Mamluks in 1291. Under Mamluk rule Palestine declined.
Turkish Rule
In 1516 the Mamluks were defeated by the Ottoman Turks. The first three centuries of Ottoman rule isolated Palestine from outside influence. In 1831, Muhammad Ali, the Egyptian viceroy nominally subject to the Ottoman sultan, occupied Palestine. Under him and his son the region was opened to European influence. Ottoman control was reasserted in 1840, but Western influence continued. Among the many European settlements established, the most significant in the long run were those of Jews, Russian Jews being the first to come (1882).
Conflict between Arabs and Zionists
In the late 19th cent. the Zionist movement was founded (see Zionism) with the goal of establishing a Jewish homeland in Palestine, and dozens of Zionist colonies were founded there. At the start of the Zionist colonization of Palestine in the late 19th cent., the rural people were Arab peasants (fellahin). Most of the population were Muslims, but in the urban areas there were sizable groups of Arab Christians (at Nazareth, Bethlehem, and Jerusalem) and of Jews (at Zefat, Tiberias, Jerusalem, Jericho, and Hebron).
At the same time Arab nationalism was developing in the Middle East in opposition to Turkish rule. In World War I the British, with Arab aid, gained control of Palestine. In the Balfour Declaration (1917) the British promised Zionist leaders to aid the establishment of a Jewish “national home” in Palestine, with due regard for the rights of non-Jewish Palestinians. However, the British had also promised Arab leaders to support the creation of independent Arab states. The Arabs believed Palestine was to be among these, an intention that the British later denied.
In 1919 there were about 568,000 Muslims, 74,000 Christians, and 58,000 Jews in Palestine. The first Arab anti-Zionist riots occurred in Palestine in 1920. The League of Nations approved the British mandate in 1922, although the actual administration of the area had begun in 1920. As part of the mandate Britain was given the responsibility for aiding the Jewish homeland and fostering Jewish immigration there. The British stressed that their policy to aid the homeland did not include making all Palestine the homeland, but rather that such a home should exist within Palestine and that there were economic limits on how many immigrants should be admitted (1922 White Paper).
In the 1920s, Jewish immigration was slight, but the Jewish communities made great economic progress. In 1929 there was serious Jewish-Arab violence occasioned by a clash at the Western, or Wailing, Wall in Jerusalem. A British report found that Arabs feared the economic and political consequences of continued Jewish immigration with its attendant land purchases. Zionists were angered when a new White Paper (1930) urged limiting immigration, but they were placated by Prime Minister Ramsay MacDonald (1931).
The rise of Nazism in Europe during the 1930s led to a great increase in immigration. Whereas there were about 5,000 immigrants authorized in 1932, about 62,000 were authorized in 1935. Arabs conducted strikes and boycotts; a general strike in 1936, organized by Haj Amin al Husayni, mufti of Jerusalem, lasted six months. Some Arabs acquired weapons and formed a guerrilla force. The Peel commission (1937), finding British promises to Zionists and Arabs irreconcilable, declared the mandate unworkable and recommended the partition of Palestine into Jewish, Arab, and British (largely the holy places) mandatory states. The Zionists reluctantly approved partition, but the Arabs rejected it, objecting particularly to the proposal that the Arab population be forcibly transferred out of the proposed Jewish state.
The British dropped the partition idea and announced a new policy (1939 White Paper). Fifteen thousand Jews a year would be allowed to immigrate for the next five years, after which Jewish immigration would be subject to Arab acquiescence; Jewish land purchases were to be restricted; and within 10 years an independent, binational Palestine would be established. The Zionists were shocked by what they considered a betrayal of the Balfour Declaration. The Arabs also rejected the plan, demanding instead the immediate creation of an Arab Palestine, the prohibition of further immigration, and a review of the status of all Jewish immigrants since 1918.
The outbreak of World War II prevented the implementation of the plan, except for the restriction on land transfers. The Zionists and most Arabs supported Britain in the war (although Haj Amin al Husayni was in Germany and negotiated Palestine's future with Hitler), but tension inside Palestine increased. The Haganah, a secret armed group organized by the Jewish Agency, and the Irgun and the Stern Gang, terrorist groups, were active. British officials were killed by the terrorists. The horrible plight of European Jewry led influential forces in the United States to lobby for support of an independent Jewish state, and President Truman requested that Britain permit the admission of 100,000 Jews. Illegal immigration, often involving survivors of Hitler's death camps, took place on a large scale. The independent Arab states organized the Arab League to exert internationally what pressure they could against the Zionists.
An Anglo-American commission recommended (1946) that Britain continue administering Palestine, rescind the land-transfer restrictions, and admit 100,000 Jews, and that the underground Jewish armed groups be disbanded. A plan for autonomy for Jews and Arabs within Palestine was discussed at a London conference (1947) of British, Arabs, and Zionists, but no agreement could be reached. The British, declaring their mandate unworkable and despairing of finding a solution, turned the Palestine problem over to the United Nations (Feb., 1947). At that time there were about 1,091,000 Muslims, 614,000 Jews, and 146,000 Christians in Palestine.
Sections in this article:
The Columbia Electronic Encyclopedia, 6th ed. Copyright © 2007, Columbia University Press. All rights reserved.
Read more: Palestine, region, Asia: History — Infoplease.com http://www.infoplease.com/ce6/world/A0920795.html#ixzz14tICsupB
In the above article it speaks of the amount of Jews in Palestine some might mistake that for the amount of people living to the west of the Jordan river but it actually takes in to account the parts of modern Israel, the West Bank and Gaza, Jordan, and Egypt
Palestine
Palestine (păl'ustīn) [key], historic region on the eastern shore of the Mediterranean Sea, at various times comprising parts of modern Israel, the West Bank and Gaza, Jordan, and Egypt; also known as the Holy Land. The name is derived from a word meaning “land of the Philistines.” This article discusses mainly the geography and the history of Palestine until the United Nations took up the Palestine problem in 1947; for the economy and later history, seeIsrael, Jordan, and West Bank.
In the Bible, Palestine is called Canaan before the invasion of Joshua; the usual Hebrew name is Eretz Israel [land of Israel]. Palestine is the Holy Land of Jews, having been promised to them by God; of Christians because it was the scene of Jesus' life; and of Muslims because they consider Islam to be the heir of Judaism and Christianity and because Jerusalem is the site, according to Muslim tradition, of Muhammad's ascent to heaven. The Holy Land derives its special character from being a place of pilgrimage. Shrines, shared in common by several religions, cluster most numerously in and about Jerusalem, Bethlehem, Nazareth, and Hebron.
Read more: Palestine, region, Asia — Infoplease.com http://www.infoplease.com/ce6/world/A0837349.html#ixzz14tKdhSAv
Palestinians = Philistines. They inhabited the plain of Palestine during the old testament. Their country was from Joppa to the south of Gaza. They originated from a place called Caphtor which may have been Crete or some island in the Aegean. It is thought they may have been Aryans. According to the Bible. The OT is a great read for history.
The biblical philistines ARE NOT The modern day Palestinians.
Philistine origins are traced to the arrival as conquerors of a group of people on the coast of Canaan and Gaza. They were culturally related to the Mycenean or proto-Greek world and came from a point of origin in the Aegean thought by most scholars to have been Crete.[6][7] They conquered the local Caananite western-Semitic speaking population of the coast, and together the conquered people and the invaders created a blended, west-Semitic speaking culture that we call Philistine.[7]
In the Bible, Deuteronomy 2:23 records that the Caphtorites came from Crete, destroyed the Avvites and usurped their land. The Talmud (Chullin 60b) notes that the Avvites were the original Philistine people in the days of Abraham while the Philistines of later times were descended from the conquering Caphtorites.
In Egypt, a people called the "Peleset" (or, more precisely, prst), generally identified with the Philistines, appear in the Medinet Habu inscription of Ramesses III,[8] where he describes his victory against theSea Peoples, as well as in the Onomasticon of Amenope (late Twentieth Dynasty) and Papyrus Harris I, a summary of Ramesses III's reign written in the reign of Ramesses IV. 19th century Bible scholars identified the land of the Philistines (Philistia) with Palastu and Pilista found in Assyrian inscriptions, according to Easton's Bible Dictionary (1897).
The Philistines occupied the five cities of Gaza, Ashkelon, Ashdod, Ekron, and Gath, along the coastal strip of southwestern Canaan, that belonged to Egypt up to the closing days of the Nineteenth Dynasty(ended 1185 BC). The biblical stories of Samson, Samuel, Saul and David include accounts of Philistine-Israelite conflicts. The Philistines long held a monopoly on iron smithing, a skill they possibly acquired during conquests in Anatolia.
According to the Bible, the Philistines made frequent incursions against the Israelites. There was almost perpetual war between the two peoples. The Philistine pentapolis were ruled by seranim (×¡Ö°×¨Ö¸× Ö´××, "lords"), who acted together for the common good, though to what extent they had a sense of a "nation" is not clear without literary sources. After their defeat by the Hebrew king David, who originally for a time worked as a mercenary for Achish of Gath, kings replaced the seranim, governing from various cities. Some of these kings were called Abimelech, which was initially a name and later a dynastic title.
The Philistines lost their independence to Tiglath-Pileser III of Assyria by 732 BC, and revolts in following years were all crushed. Nebuchadrezzar II of Babylon eventually conquered all of Syria and theKingdom of Judah, and the former Philistine cities became part of the Neo-Babylonian Empire. There are few references to the Philistines after this time period. However, Ezekiel 25:16, Zechariah 9:6, and I Macabees 3 make mention of the Philistines, indicating that they still existed as a people in some capacity after the Babylonian invasion. The Philistines disappear as a distinct group by the late fifth century BCE.[9] Subsequently the mixed people of the former Philstine cities were converted to Judaism by the Hasmoneans.
The name "Palestine" comes, via Greek and Latin, from the Philistines; see History of Palestine.
Lawyered son. Nice article
Our ally who consistently causes the international community to have a lower opinion of us due to our unconditional support. No support should be unconditional.
Oi. Such a schlememdebooble.
"Our ally" who consistently never has one of their soldiers fight alongside one of ours in any of our conflicts... Used to be that's what the word "ally" meant.
I thought El fatah had rounded up all hamas people in the West Bank..anyway since el fatah and Israel work together on security.. he is now out of the way in an Israeli prison,..What was he doing running loose? Gaza is a basket case controlled by the terrorists hamas.. can`t let that happen on the West Bank.....Abbas. even if you dob`t like Israel..control these demon hamas !..they will cut your throat as easily as they will cut the throat of anyone else who doesn`t share their brutal maniacal killer sharia law.!.
This is the very reason why Egypt supports the Blockade of Gaza. They don't want Hamas nut jobs around anymore than Israel does. Hamas does not care who they target, If you don't support there crack pot ideas 110% than you become a target.
The article said Israel had arrested him before, and let him go in 2009... so ask them.
Is it cutting Some Ones throat when You are trying to survive??? You have to remember Israel has the Arab League at everyone of Their Boarders!!! Don't You Think They have the right to protect Themselves any way They have to???
"Israel arrests Hamas lawmaker in West Bank." "Hamas lawmaker?" Another pile of foul smelling garbage from AP and MSNBC. Hamas is a terrorist organization. Hamas is a gang of killers, thieves, kidnappers, rapists and extortionists. They've fired thousands of missiles at civilians in Israel murdering and injuring many people and causing widespread destruction. Not a day goes by without an attack against civilians. Their charter calls for the annihilation of Israel and the extermination of the Jewish people. Hamas is engaged in a genocidal war against Israel. "Hamas lawmaker." What a pile of putrid, bigoted propaganda.
It's not the only anti-Semitic statement in the article.
Not just Israel, as the misleading writer would have you believe.
The USA, Australia, the EU, Japan, Jordan and others have Hamas listed as a terrorist organization.
and the terroist actions of israel are once again applauded... when are you going to step up and fulfill your obligations as an occupying power?
I hope my American Weapons kill as many Hamas terrorists as possible.
al... just one question, where is the proof he is a terrorist?
Dave 294 where is the proof you are even human. You roll off crap denouncing Israel like your a coping machine gone mad. 90% of the time your not even on topic.
He is a card carrying member of Hamas, A terrorist group according to most of the world. Both Israel and the West bank Palestinians lock these idiots up ever chance they get.
Gray beard, I don't know if this guy was a terrorist or not. What I do know, is that if Israel is unwilling to accept any members of Hamas (specifically those who have never picked up a weapon, of which there are many), there is zero hope for peace. They are too large a group to be wholly rejected. Similar to the way that members of the Taliban will be re-integrated.
Look at Fatah and the Kach party/movement. Both partied turned to legitimate political activity when it made sense.
Gray beard-
you are saying to Dace294 either agree with what we are going (right or wrong) or I am going to attack you by words.
thank God that you don't have special weapons to kill me for example from my name/email!
I am sure that you won't hesitate about it. killing human being is hobby for you guys now.
freedom is for everyone.
give the palestinian their freedom and stop killing people around the world.
as a chosen peolple by God, you are not suppose to kill, but promote life. isn't id if you kill one person like killing the rest of the world and saving one like saving all man kind. follow the teaching of the Torah (word of God) not the teaching of some lunetic human.
awh gray beard, you love me dont you... your crush is actually quite frightening... there is no proof in the article, israel didnt cite any, i am just asking where the proof is...
so where is it?
and once and for all, i am not a terrorist, born and rasied in the us, former full supporter of israel, until my eyes were openned
OK... for the record...
In General I tend to oppose Israeli policies,
And I also 100% denounce Hamas as a terrorist organization.
I support a two state solution, returning to pre-1967 borders.
Having said that...
I'm having some trouble understanding posts #4 and #4.1
These two quoted statements...
Are considered by dougjmiller and Steven B to be....
"Another pile of foul smelling garbage from AP and MSNBC"
"a pile of putrid, bigoted propaganda"
"(one of several) anti-Semitic statement(s)"
Don't you think maybe you guys are getting a bit hyper-sensitive here?
If the guy was an elected Hamas official, then he IS a "lawmaker"...
You can call him evil, or a terrorist, or satan if you like, but his occupation is a lawmaker.
AND...
Israel DOES think Hamas is a terrorist organization... the sentence is factual... the implication that no other country feels the same way, is completely assumed by you, and not implied by the language as you suggested.
I find it annoying when a black person pulls the race card, or a Jewish person pulls the anti-semetic card, with no real justification... it's just a defense mechanism on a hair trigger... Now... If and when the situation arises where pulling those cards is truly justified, then I will support any individual or group standing up for themselves in the face of bigotry... but when it's used repeatedly, without justification... it's just annoying, and like with the boy who cried wolf, people eventually stop paying attention to you.
No, I am sensitive to the fact that MSNBC, Reuters and the AP all have an definite anti-Israel, and by proxy anti-Jewish agenda.
I read fluff articles from these yellow journalists about Gaza surfers, and I see nothing about rocket attacks. I read about construction in Jerusalem, and nothing about Jordan revoking citizenship of their Palestinian inhabitants.
I wonder why these people never mention that Israel unilaterally withdrew from Gaza, and for their olive branch they got rockets and terrorist attacks.
I read about alleged IDF 'atrocities' and zero about Hamas/Iranian terrorists shooting from hospitals, schools and Mosques.
I read about alleged Israeli tree-cutters violating the Lebanese border in glaring headlines, and when the truth comes out that the killing was a deliberate sniper attack against an Israeli officer some 200 yards away, and the fact that there was no border violation.....it's relegated to the back pages.
Finally, I resent the 'moderators' of Newsvine, who have whacked me repeatedly for alleged violations, and then I see much worse from the Jew haters on this site, who lie, spout anti-Israeli and anti-Jewish propaganda, some of it straight out of the Protocols of the Elders of Zion.....without so much as a whimper.
Steven, I so often hear the Israeli supporters here (and I hate to even term it that way. Just because I criticize some of Israel's policies doesn't mean I am anti-Israeli) say that Israel is not just Jews, but Arabs, Christians, etc. Then, you say that anti-Israel means anti-Jew? To me that seems like a contradiction.
You'll notice most people hear don't defend the rocket attacks of the Palestinians. Some do point out, that they have resulted in only a handful of deaths, while the retaliations of Israel have resulted in thousands.
I have yet to see anyone support suicide bombings.
Israel is not above scrutiny. The real test will be how they are judged 100 years from now. If nothing changes, I don't think they will be viewed on favorably by almost any historian.
Diogenes-2635056 banned, constantly smearing Jews, failed audition.
7 deleted, tn37849 flaming them. You're suspended for a week for violating #1 of the Code of Honor - repeatedly.
Alleged violations? Follow the rules and you don't get suspended, Steven B. Simple.
You ARE in fact overly sensitive, and sound very much like a paranoid conspiracy theorist.
And contrary to your by-proxy theory, one CAN in fact be opposed to Israeli policies and agendas, WITHOUT being anti-Jewish... I am proof of that as my best friend is VERY Jewish, as well as some members of my family.
I haven't seen many reports of rocket attacks in the last few months either... do you have links to reports stating otherwise?
Because that is not a news story in and of itself at this point and time... it WAS at the time, and it WAS reported, at the time, but now it is just a sad footnote to the whole insane dispute.
Well... IDF (being that they are NOT a recognized terrorist organization, as Hamas is) SHOULD be held to a higher code of conduct than terrorist thugs... just as our troops were held accountable (at least in the media) for their transgressions in Iraq.
That's an exaggeration... "glaring headlines"? It was a story, among other stories... and it's often the case that sensationalist eye grabbing stories get more hits, (and therefore bumped up in status) than the stories about the truth that comes out later on... people just don't give those stories as many hits... and editors push stories that get more attention... that is not a scenario unique to Israeli articles.
Again... paranoia... if you adhere to the code, you don't get flagged... I too have seen offensive posts remain intact, but that is because the community has not reported them enough... live (and write) by your own standards and ethics, and keep to the code, and don't think because others do something you should too.
Finally... I would like to emphasize that I never see you make the distinction between Palestinians that are Hamas terrorists and ones that are not... there are 4 million of them in the territories... it's quite obvious that if the majority of that number were Hamas, there would be an even deadlier situation there now... and whatever the actual number may be... it's also obvious that many Israeli policies tend to drive any moderates into the arms of radicals, and increase their numbers, and exacerbate the situation.
thanks for taking the time v...
The problem, tyler, is that deletion of a post you consider offensive, also deletes any other post under the offensive material. That seems to run counter to the Newsvine Code of Honor #2 -- Newsvine's primary purpose is to provide a place for people to share and discuss topics relating to the news. When you remove the opinions and discussions of others who have in no way violated the Code of Honor or the User Agreement, it becomes a form of censorship in it's own right.
I read your post, and for the most part, it is well thought out and a reasonable perspective.
Regarding your observation, perhaps you are correct. I am overly sensitive, and I will tell you why:
Although this event (speaking of a mere 70-odd years) regarding the State of Israel is important in our time, and for a variety of reasons, my perspective is of a somewhat longer view.
There is no question that Jews have been persecuted throughout the centuries.
This has taken place under a number of guises. Jews are unique in that they have been systematically persecuted by a number of different Peoples and cultures.
For example, Jews were blamed by many for the Black Death, even though Jews died just the same as everyone else.
Words in our vocabulary have been created....words like pogrom and ghetto.
Interesting phrases, like "Hep, Hep.....hooray!" have been mainstreamed by our culture, with nary a thought given as to the origin.
I would contend that Israel itself is a reflection of the very 'paranoia' and 'hyper-sensitivity' you refer to.
As joke goes: It's not really paranoia if everyone is out to get you.
Any rational person knows that the hostility against the Jews in the Arab/Persian world is a smoke screen, using the age-old policy of Jewish scape-goating to place the frustration people feel on an easy target.
In this case, I refer to the Government of Egypt, for example, that uses the media to keep the Egyptian Street hyped up on "Jews using the blood of Arab children to make Passover matzoh".
This way, the people forget how they're being repressed by their governments by displacing their anger.
It's an age-old situation.
And now, many Jews have figured out that going passively to their demise isn't the appropriate response.
So, Israel will hammer anyone who trifles with them. And who can blame them? How many existential wars has Israel fought? Against how many nations?
Look at Lebanon. After the 2006 war, the UN came in to establish a peace, with the agenda of limiting the capability of Hesb'Allah.
Now, Hesb'Allah has more rockets, missiles and anti-tank weaponry than they had to begin with.
And they're much more advanced too.
To the south, Iranian backed Hamas is doing the same thing.
Israel has every right to be fearful and ready for aggression.
Israel, and Jews do not hold the patent on suffering, being persecuted against, or being the target of hatred. What has happened in the past is truly sad, there is no questioning that. I would contend that on the whole, Catholics have been equally persecuted.
I think the problem most of the world has with Israeli policies is that they consistently hold on to the notion that they are the only victims in this mess, and have no complicity in it, and no accountability to anyone. Further, the picture painted by many Israeli activists is that the suffering of the Israeli's is worse, or even on par, with that of their neighbors. That's not to discount the pain and suffering Israeli's no doubt endure, but all you have to do is look at the standard of living gap between the two sides to see who suffers more on a daily basis.
Of course... And there is no way around that fact...
We can take note of certain points however.... such as, they are one of the longest surviving cultures with a documented written history (although it is a book interlaced with mythology and fables)... So being around that long, allows for more opportunity to be attacked and persecuted...
Also perspective is important... for example, from the point of view of the Canaanites, the Hebrews were the aggressor who committed genocide by murdering them all and stealing their land... as per their God's instructions...
BUT that's all just talking points... Yes... you are 100% correct... the Jews have been persecuted for thousands of years.
Isn't that just one of several theories? It IS possible of course, but I wasn't aware it was accepted as a valid origin.
I would agree.
EXCELLENT point... most people simply see it as an ideological clash, and that's all... Kind of like when Bush said "they hate us for our freedoms"... no they don't....
You are right... it is a smoke screen... I've always contended that at it's core this is really just a land squabble... the religions are simply used to fuel the fire.
A good example... but wouldn't a better response to that, be to say...
If that is what you think we do, then we would like to invite some of you, our neighbors, to experience passover with us... learn about our ways... Islam is an offshoot of Judaism... come see where you're religion originated... you will not find any blood in our matzoh... but the potato latkes are delicious with some sour cream, or applesauce...
Idealistic... I know.... so, sue me.
He who lives by the sword....
So it can be argued that exercising that aggression in the name of defense, actually made the situation worse.
Hamas can never be a match for Israel militarily... Iran or no Iran...
My understanding is that, contrary to popular opinion, Demographically speaking Israel is only 3/4 Jewish... The rest being Muslim, Christian, and what have you...
So why must we think of it in terms of "Jewish" only, and what Jews have suffered throughout history... when rationalizing Israels current motives, and actions...?
Historically, the US advocated slavery longer than it did not, yet now we are all about freedom... England was a conquering nation, yet now it is not.... Why can't we look at Israel as a Nation, not just as a Jewish refuge... a NEW nation not 1000's of years old, but less than 100.... and have it operate lawfully, and ethically without using justifications from the past persecutions of the ancestors of 3/4 of its population?
Dave: How can You call Israel a Tarriest Country??? If the Muslin would stop trying to kill Them... The Muslin's would not be dieing!!! Hamas are the Tarriest for shooting Rockets into Israel...
ChiCity: Israel offered to make Hamas a State and gave Them land for Their Own!!! How does Hamas answer them??? They shot Rockets into Israel!!! The rather kill the Israeli than have PEACE with Them...
Steve B.: Who do you think keeps shooting rockets into Israel if not Hamas??? Do You think Israel is doing it so There won't be PEACE there???
We have more proof that He is a Tarriest!!! Than You do that You have any brains...
Ibahim: All the Palestine have to do is force Hamas from shooting Rockets into Israel and The PLO. Hamas and Palestine sign a PEACE TREATY with Israel!!!
Dave: You ask for proof on the Article!!! But You never give any proof on the crap You post on here... Isn't where the Article enough proof for You??? Are Maybe You think I get My articles from a Bias source???
Chin City: Which do You think Israel is more worried about right now??? Whether They survive are what People will think of Them now and in the Future???
lmk.... all i asked for was proof he was a terrorist... the article claimed he was but did not offer why... if someone is going to get arrested, by an occupying military power, shouldnt the evidence that he is a terrorist be offered? if they need to keep it secret for security reasons, cant they at least say that?
Freedman: MSNBC has the right to delete post They feel doesn't belong here!!! They have deleted a lot of mine... They have to keep it fair on here and no name calling!!!
Chin City: Wouldn't You say having 6 Million Jews killed is showing how Much they care about other lives??? After that the Jewish People said it will never happen again!!! If You think They are wrong I feel sorry for You??? It is to bad Those Others that were killed in a Holocaust doesn't feel the same way!!! Maybe then There wouldn't be anymore Holocaust...
V: These People hate the Jews and Israel so much They don't care if They are in the right!!! The Palestine in Israel is a lot better off than any of The Muslin any where else in the Middle east... Isn't that what really counts???
Dave if You hang out in a Tarriest Group!!! Isn't that enough Proof???
lmk, if i hang out with a smoker does that make me a smoker? we cannot say just because you are in hamas you are a terrorist. that is like saying all catholic priests are child molesters!
No but You will die any way!!! If You aren't one of Them don't hang out with Them... Would You hang out with People You knew were killers??? I know I sure wouldn't!!!
but to that extent, did he hang out with them? my entire point is there is not enough detail in the article to claim he is or isnt!
Israel is again acting out as a rogue nation! Arrest those that speak out against Israel on trumped up charges! The world and especially America had better wake up, smell the coffee, and place sanctions against Israel for crimes against humanity; the Palestinians!
Crimes against humanity are from the Hamas Terrorist shooting missiles into Israel.
To assume that you half witted response is anything intellectual is the real stretch!. To bad the Israelis didn't bulldoze your shack too.
So while your an Israel hater, tell me when Hamas has ever offered peace. Thats right never. Hamas people are pig eating incestual dogs of which you aspire to be.
Well the UN gave Palestine to the Jewish people, so live with it. Neighboring Arab countries tried to take it away from Israel away and lost (the war and some land). Live with it. You're not getting it back unless Israel wants to give it back. Not you or any of your brothers can do anything about that.
So you take issue with the incest remark. Guess the rest hits the mark. Funny how every religion esposes freedom and was intiated by "men of peace" oh except the Muslim religion. Yes, that came to be at the point of a sword.
You're right Adam, Israel will continue to do what it wants regardless of how the rest of the world community feels about it. There is nothing we can do about that. What we can do is reduce aid, stop vetoing every UN security vote, etc. I think your attitude shows that Israel doesn't think it has to be accountable to anyone. I do not support terrorism in any way, and believe that the Palestinians have committed many horrible acts. In my eyes though, that doesn't absolve Israel from their own actions.
What You don't understand... All Israel is trying to do is make things safer for all Their People!!! They are Muslin, Catholic and Jews... What is wrong with that???
Adam: Israel had the land before there was even any Palestine and Hamas!!! They had the land even before Jordan stowed it from Them... So Please tell Me how Israel could steal it from Them??? They won the land in 4 wars that They started against Them!!! So Please tell Me since When any Country wins a war has to answer to the Losers??? Otherwise what is the sense of having a War if Your going to give everything back to Them after You win it???
Chin City: Israel will do what ever it takes to make Their Country free from Killing Their People is right!!! After all They have the obligation to protect Their Palestine, Catholic and Jews that live there...
LMK, what happened after WWI, when Germany was saddled with all the blame and debt from the war? What kind of enviornment did that create? Would you agree that it aided Hitler's ability to take advantage of the uncertainty and fear, and lack of standard of living of the German people, and played an enormous role in WWII? Those in power need to do what is right not just for themselves, but to take a bigger picture perspective on what is the best course of action.
Look at Japan as an example. After we defeated them in the most convincing way, we took an active role in rebuilding their country, and returning their dignity.
Hampster: Please tell Me how protecting Your People is a bad Thing??? Are You saying You would protect Your Family if You knew Some One was trying to Kill Them???
The Abab League are the progresser not Israel!!! Israel would be glad to help Them build Their Country up for PEACE... But they rather kill them than make PEACE with Them!!! So what choice Do They leave with Israel???
This is GREAT news. They should waterboard him for information.
Don't be so ignorant as to condone torture....
Waterboarding isn't torture.
Holding Gilad Shalit captive for years is torture...
I've heard that said before... and I've heard it said by a few people that were so sure of it, that they were willing to try it out to prove their point... They changed their minds VERY quickly... Waterboarding IS torture.
Being that there are roughly some 7,000 Palestinians, including 270 who are under the age of 18, currently held in Israeli prisons... Are you really going to say that imprisoning one man is more of a crime? Granted... I have no doubts that the majority of those in prison, probably deserve to be there... but I also have no doubts that many, including those children, do not.
LOL...I don't condone torture. But when you have a bunch of idiots running around the world blowing up innocent people and cutting off the heads of the captured prisoners then you get any and ALL the information out of them ANY way you can and then you hunt down and either kill or waterboard the next ones to continue the fight until ALL these idiots are wiped out. Now where is that hoes? LEARN IT!!!!
Dov: Why don't they figure how many died before We got there compared to how many are dieing now We are there??? Because I bet more died in the Holocaust they had There before than has died in the time We have been there!!!
It is better than shopping off the Heads of Those They captured!!!
V: I wonder if You would say that if Children were killing Some One in Your Family like They do??? We had that problem when We were fighting in Vietnam!!! It took 50ty years before the People got over it... You think They would learn from the Past??? What is more important Killing children re putting Them in prison???
Israel is the only country in the world, that repeatedly gets away with murder, violates international and human right laws. Basically, Israel has a grip on the west.
Not True, pick just about any Middle east country as you see that they do the same thing to their own people. Israel has a grip because its the only country over there with a real government.
That real government has come with a price tag of over $2 trillion of US taxpayer money.
Israel is the largest recipient of US foreign aid.
What defines a "real" government?
The one with the most tanks and missles.
Governments without adequate military hardware are not real.
So you are saying that NATO including the US and England does not do these things.
At 5pm EST Friday 22nd October 2010 WikiLeaks released the largest classified military leak in history. The 391,832 reports ('The Iraq War Logs'), document the war and occupation in Iraq, from 1st January 2004 to 31st December 2009 (except for the months of May 2004 and March 2009) as told by soldiers in the United States Army. Each is a 'SIGACT' or Significant Action in the war. They detail events as seen and heard by the US military troops on the ground in Iraq and are the first real glimpse into the secret history of the war that the United States government has been privy to throughout.
The reports detail 109,032 deaths in Iraq, comprised of 66,081 'civilians'; 23,984 'enemy' (those labeled as insurgents); 15,196 'host nation' (Iraqi government forces) and 3,771 'friendly' (coalition forces). The majority of the deaths (66,000, over 60%) of these are civilian deaths.That is 31 civilians dying every day during the six year period. For comparison, the 'Afghan War Diaries', previously released by WikiLeaks, covering the same period, detail the deaths of some 20,000 people. Iraq during the same period, was five times as lethal with equivallent population size.
You are also saying that Arab Countries do not perform barbarous acts against their own people. like cutting off thieves hands and killing woman who do not cover their faces?
Diogenes, if the Israeli people were to commit genocide, there would be no more Arabs in Gaza. Not to mention no Arab-Israeli citizens and no Arabs in the West Bank. Israel has that military power. The arabs don't. One can only conclude, based on that, that the Israelis are neither committing, nor trying to commit, genocide. When they are shot at, they shoot back. They kill civilians because the shooters use human shields. They kill more arabs than arabs kill them because they're better shots with better guns. As long as someone is shooting at them, though, they're allowed to shoot back. That's not called genocide. That's called self-defense.
It's called escalation, or lack of any mitigating circumstances. Firing back with an assault rifle when someone throws a rock I hope is not something you condone? You use the "might makes right" argument. If you have studied philosophy, and maybe you have, you would know of the brutal history attached to that argument, and how people look on those who used it after hundreds of years have passed. How do you think Israel will be judged 100 years from now?
Flatwood: How is protecting Yourselves from Being killed killing other People??? Know One would die if They would make PEACE with Israel instead of trying to kill Them!!!
Freeman: The United States benefits more from helping Israel than Israel gains from Us!!!
Chin City: If rocks don't kill??? Why do They use Rocks to kill Their Woman??? What is the difference what You use to kill Any One??? Isn't it important That They are trying to kill You???
Until The Palestinians can show that they are capable of governing themselves, Israel is forced to take these measures. If other Arab nations would help to provide leadership rather than just insist that Israel cede land the Palestinians would benefit.
MSNBC does everything it can to portray Israel in a bad light, and portray Hamas as some kind of benevolent group.
It's sickening, immoral and blatant anti-Semitism.
Here's an article you WON'T see in MSNBC/Volkishe Beobachter
http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/Fight+against+anti+Semitism+renewed+with+Ottawa+Protocol/3802709/story.html
OTTAWA — Stepped-up efforts within Canada and around the world are needed to combat rising anti-Semitism, says a freshly penned international declaration designed to stamp out the "most enduring of all hatreds."
Because Arabs are also Semitic people, anti-Semitism takes on an odd meaning. Maybe it means sick of the Middle East squabbling that has no end.
FYI - A Semite means a descendant of Shem
Newsweek, 6/3/10
Jews have historically considered themselves “people of the book” (am hasefer in Hebrew), referring to sacred tomes, but the phrase is turning out to have an equally powerful, if unintended meaning: scientists are able to read Jewish genomes like a history book.
The latest DNA volume weighs in on the controversial, centuries-old claim that European Jews are all the descendants of Khazars, a Turkic group of the north Caucasus who converted to Judaism in the late eighth and early ninth century. The DNA has spoken: no.
In the wake of studies in the 1990s that supported biblically based notions of a priestly caste descended from Aaron, brother of Moses, an ambitious new project to analyze genomes collected from Jewish volunteers has yielded its first discoveries. In a paper with the kind of catchy title you rarely see in science journals—“Abraham’s Children in the Genome Era”—scientists report that the Jews of the Diaspora share a set of telltale genetic markers, supporting the traditional belief that Jews scattered around the world have a common ancestry.
But various Diaspora populations have their own distinct genetic signatures, shedding light on their origins and history. In addition to the age-old question of whether Jews are simply people who share a religion or are a distinct population, the scientific verdict is settling on the latter.
Although the origin of the Jews has been traced, archeologically, to the Middle East in the second millennium B.C.E., what happened next has been more opaque. To sort it out, researchers collected DNA from Iranian, Iraqi, Syrian, and Ashkenazi Jews around New York City; Turkish Sephardic Jews in Seattle; Greek Sephardic Jews in Thessaloniki and Athens; and Italian Jews in Rome as part of the Jewish HapMap Project. (All four grandparents of each participant had to have come from the same community.) As the scientists will report in the next issue of the American Journal of Human Genetics, the analysis shows that “each of the Jewish populations formed its own distinctive cluster, indicating the shared ancestry and relative genetic isolation of the members of each of those groups.”
Jewish populations, that is, have retained their genetic coherence just as they have retained their cultural and religious traditions, despite migrations from the Middle East into Europe, North Africa, and beyond over the centuries, says geneticist Harry Ostrer of NYU Langone Medical Center, who led the study. Each Diaspora group has distinctive genetic features “representative of each group’s genetic history,” he says, but each also “shares a set of common genetic threads” dating back to their common origin in the Middle East. “Each of the Jewish populations formed its own distinctive cluster, indicating the shared ancestry and relative genetic isolation of the members of each of those groups.”
The various Jewish groups were more related to each other than to non-Jews, as well. Within every Jewish group, individuals shared as much of their genome as two fourth or fifth cousins, with Italian, Syrian, Iranian, and Iraqi Jews the most inbred, in the sense that they married within the small, close-knit community. In general, the genetic similarity of any two groups was larger the closer they lived to one another, but there was an exception: Turkish and Italian Jews were most closely related genetically, but are quite separated geographically.
Historical records suggest that Iranian and Iraqi Jews date from communities that formed in Persia and Babylon, respectively, in the fourth to sixth centuries B.C.E., and the DNA confirms that. The genetic signatures of these groups show that they remained relatively isolated—inbred—for some 3,000 years. The DNA also reveals that these Middle Eastern Jews diverged from the ancestors of today’s European Jews about 100 to 150 generations ago, or sometime during the first millennium B.C.E.
That’s when the Jewish communities in Italy, the Balkans, and North Africa originated, from Jews who migrated or were expelled from Palestine and from people who converted to Judaism during Hellenic times. During that period Jews proselytized with an effectiveness that would put today’s Mormons to shame: at the height of the Roman Empire, as the Roman historian Josephus chronicled, mass conversions produced 6 million practicing Jews, or 10 percent of the population of the Roman Empire. The conversions brought in DNA that had not been part of the original gene pool in the land of Abraham.
The DNA analysis undermines the claim that most of today’s Jews, particularly the Ashkenazi, are the direct lineal descendants of converted Khazars—which has angered many in the Jewish community as an implicit attack on the Jews’ claim to the land of Israel, since it implies that today’s Jews have no blood ties to the original Jews of the Middle East. Instead, find the scientists, at most there was “limited admixture with local populations, including Khazars and Slavs ... during the 1,000-year (second millennium) history of the European Jews.”
Of the non-Jewish Europeans, northern Italians were most genetically similar to the Jews, followed by the Sardinians and French. The Druze, Bedouins, and Palestinians were closest to the Iranian, Iraqi, and Syrian Jews. That is evidence of “a shared genetic history of related Middle Eastern and non-Semitic Mediterranean ancestors who chose different religious and tribal affiliations.” Adds Ostrer, “the study supports the idea of a Jewish people linked by a shared genetic history. Yet the admixture with European people explains why so many European and Syrian Jews have blue eyes and blond hair.”
Southern Europeans were the closest genetic cousins of Ashkenazi, Sephardic, and Italian Jews, reflecting the large-scale conversion of these Southern European populations to Judaism some 2,000 years ago, when European Jewry was forming. The Sephardic groups share genetic makers with North Africans, probably a result of marriages between Moors and Jews in Spain from 711 to1492.
Several details of the Ashkenazi genome imply that centuries ago, the population experienced a severe bottleneck, in which the size of a group plummets, followed by a rapid expansion. That jibes with the historical record showing that the Jewish population in Western and Eastern Europe bottomed out at about 50,000 in the Middle Ages and then soared to 500,000 by the 19th century, growing at twice the rate of non-Jews—something called “the demographic miracle.”
Analysis of Jewish genomes has been yielding fascinating findings for more than a decade. A pioneer in this field, Michael Hammer of the University of Arizona, made the first big splash when he discovered that genetics supports the biblical account of a priestly family, the Cohanim, descended from Aaron, the brother of Moses: one specific genetic marker on the Y chromosome (which is passed on from father to son, as membership in the priestly family would be) is found in 98.5 percent of people who self-identify as Cohanim, he and colleagues reported in a 1997 paper in Nature (the PBS science series Nova did a nice segment on that work, summarized here).
The Cohanim DNA has been found in both Ashkenazi and Sephardic Jews, evidence that it predates the time when the two groups diverged, about 1,000 years ago. DNA can also be used to infer when particular genetic markers appeared, and suggests that the Cohanim emerged about 106 generations ago, making it fall during what is thought to be the period of the exodus from Egypt, and thus Aaron’s lifetime.
Sharon Begley is NEWSWEEK’s science editor
How about the abuse of the Holocaust reperations money that surfaced today? Thousands illiegaly drawing aid from the fund, mostly elderly Russian Jews. This is not an attack, I just read the article.
Freeman: There would be a end if People weren't fueling Them to keep on killing!!! As long as Arms Dealer can make money on Wars... There will be wars!!!
Procrusters: Through out Centuries the Jewish People have been hated, Persecuted are in slaved because Who They were!!! What is the fairness of that??? All We want is to be able to live Our lives in PEACE!!! Please tell Me what is wrong with that??? Should We be hated because We believe to better Ourselves???
Chin City: There was 6 million Jews killed in the Holocaust!!! Are You saying that Those that lose Family there have no right to get money From Germany for Their Family Lose??? Not all the Jews do it too!!! My Fathers Whole Family but Him and 2 Brothers were killed there... My Family didn't go after the money!!! Wouldn't You say it would be fair if We did???
Yes, it would be fair. That isn't what happened. Are you going to defend these people that defrauded the fund? I too have several friends whose grandparents dies in Auschwitz. I imagine they would not defend these people who were illegally drawing money, or the administrators who embezzled money either.
I would prefer the Palestinians wake up to the smell of Napalm. hampster must mean the size of your brain.
Yep it was because of that time that now Israel is the strongest country in the middle east and will be that way long after we are gone.
You're a disgusting example of everything that is wrong with the world.
I suggest you go to Israel and spout some of that offal you post so bravely from behind the keyboard.
They'd be quite happy to stomp a mudhole in you.
Which is more than you deserve.
it doenst happen often, but steven i must admit i do agree with you
Steven, I echo Dave's sentiments
What a disgusting post...
Some peoples ignorance knows no bounds....
Hopefully Diogenes getting banned will restore some of your faith in the Newsvine moderators not having a conspiracy against you Steven?
Gee, I wonder what Israel would call it if Hamas "arrested" one of its lawmakers. People are figuring out who the real terrorist nation is. Israel has become exactly what it hates the most.
Sure and every time when Israel tries to extend the hand of peace (no not perfect peace but peace none the less) The Hamas things sink any effort. If they really cared for their own people they would look for solutions instead of killing their own. They don't care. Eliminate Israel is their mantra and it will never get fulfilled.
So the UN are terrorists. You logic is impressive in terms of stupidity. And don't give me the resistance line. Thats BS, I may have bought that but Hamas will kill anyone. Indisciminate killing to inflict terror is all Hamas is about. Maybe if they realized that any action taken against Israel is met with a harsh response against their own. S
I don't know if You heard... But the Israel Leader had to quit His trip to England because They said They would try Him for War Crimes against the Turks!!! It was the Turks that started it by attacking the Israeli Military and not letting Israel Board to check Their Goods... Please tell Me where the fairness of that is???
They were boarded in international waters, that is an act of aggression by the Israeli military. Why wouldn't the Israeli military have any transparency in their own review of the incident?
I just read this articl and I want to share: http://english.aljazeera.net/indepth/2010/11/201011964814306540.html
i read this also:http://wrmea.org/component/content/article/245-2008-november/3845-congress-watch-a-conservative-estimate-of-total-direct-us-aid-to-israel-almost-114-billion.html
US pays around $500 for every israeli per year (a family of 5 persons will get $2500.00 per year). the cost of living there is much cheaper than US.
I am thinking about converting to become a jew! but they won't accept me because my mother is not a jew!
if I got that anual money I will pay off my student loan. and I don't have to work full I will work part time. I need that money for myself, my country is giving it away to others when I am paying taxes to be given to others.
You sir are full of it. I have several coworkers that went there on holiday, The cost of live is a hell of a lot higher than it is in the US. I take the word of peopel that really have been there over wack jobs that think " If I tell enough lies maybe the people that correct me will give up and I can spread the lies in peace. " NOT A CHANCE.
the cost of living is higher all around the world when you visit a place/country, by eating outside in restaurant and not eating at home, going to hotel, and going to expensive places.
I geuss you visit only! or you are a citizen of Israel that defend it's regim for better or worse.
Al Jazeera.
What the liberal media aspires to be.
Have You been there that You know the cost of living is Cheaper in Israel than the United States??? The Majority of the United States is cheaper than the cost there!!! They have to have Their Troops on call 24 hours a Day... Do You think They can buy Their gasoline at the same price We can??? The only thing They have working for them is Their Scientist!!! They Import a lot of Things that They make better than Any One in the World!!!
It's better than being stuffed into a gym bag...The shameful @!$%#s on the other side of the pond are almost as desperate as my paramilitary trash so instead of finding out who killed their own @!$%#in citizen they are taking control of the gay bar scene...Top of the Morning to you big handsome intelligent boy...
What Are You Talking About???
Boy the hate bloggers are out in force. Israel has its warts, but than so do ever other country. What Israel does have is free elections that count a Muslim, christian and Jewish vote the same. No other country in the middle east can make that claim.
The hate bloggers can mislead and distort all day but the fact remains the government of Israel changes hands all the time. It goes liberal for a few years and than Conservitive for a few. ( Gee sounds just like the US, England, France etc)
Israel is still standing because they got on with nation building with the land they had. The arabs kept putting they energy into plans to erase Israel and in 1967 rolled the dice again. They lost and spent the next 20 years repeating the first 20 until they give up and cut the people of the west bank and gaza a drift. AND look another 20 years have gone by and the Pal's are still holding on to the dream that died 60 years ago when they said no to statehood.
Somebody tell me again why the pal's get to set the rules when they have thumb they nose at them for so long? Nobody trust them anymore they got Gaza back and were on track to get west bank back to until Hamas destroyed everything with Bombs and attacks against not only jews but they OWN PEOPLE.
they get to set the rules? what are they asking for that every nation agrees with? oh yeah pre 67 borders.
"Nobody trust them anymore" you got that right. No body trust Israel lies anymore.
in one hand they want to give Palestinience independence and their chattered peice of land State, and from the other hand keep building on the palestiniane land.
gray beard.. your analysis ..is basically right on..I really don`t think the the Palestinians really want a 2 state solution ..Israel accepted partition in 1948 the Palestinans rejected that.. instead hoping for a one state solution.. destroy Israel and kill all the people there.. even though it was now a sovereign recognized state.. and they could have had one also..Kuwait was a sovereign state and Iraq swallowed it..the Arabs are trying to do the same with Israel..violate international law and commit crimes against the peace and humanity.. ....fortunately Israel is well prepared to confront and deal with the international criminals that want to destroy a country ..Kuwait wasn`t strong enough to rebuff the crimes of Saddam but an international coalition finally got rid of him.. Isreal can defend itself.. but they will also have widespread help if needed .to defeat Iran hezbollah and hamas.. too many Palestinians are collaborating with nazi style terrorists ..and are being watched very closely by the intelligence forces of most of the world.. the Palaestinians could work with Jordan, Egypt and others in the mideast.. but instead are captured and brainwashed by nazi type Islamic anti semiticism,, that`s the heart of the matter..well. just like the nazis in Germany were defeated so those in the Islamic groups will also be..they try to turn the world upside down..but all you have to do is look at the results of Isalmic terrorism much of it against other Muslims.. it is similar to nazi Germany horrors...that`s what Isreal and much of the world is up against..Isreal is a victim of genocidal pyscho hatred.. to make them into the agressors is just more big lie poison.that Hitler and his gang of perverts perpetrated... those demons were defeated and the new nazis pushing violent Isllmnic genocide against the Jews and Christians will also be defeated... and justly so..!!!
Dave: What They are asking for PEACE so that They could live Their lives with their neighbors!!! Please tell Me what is wrong with that??? Those that made PEACE with Israel is a lot better off today!!!
Isreal needs to ignore anti Jew Fervor.
Those who wish to see the release of the Isreali Soldier, Should urge the holding indefinitley of all Hamas leadership members untill that soldiers release.
Of course most Isreal's dont care of the soldier, being held in Hamas's private Zoo.
They instead, love thier own creature comforts, one of which is the importation of east European girls; tricked into prostitution by jewish white slave traders.
Isreal's should embrace strenght.
ok, i may not support israel, but that is just sick
It's idiotic comments like that one, that make it so that anyone (like myself) who disagrees with Israeli policy gets looked at like they're in cahoots with some uber-liberal-satanic-anti-Jewish cabal... take your meds Joseph... in fact up the dosage.
If They didn't care about them!!! Why did They offer Them Their own State and Land???
Another example of MSNBC Bias:
Try to find this in their website:
http://www.state.gov/secretary/rm/2010/11/150760.htm
Millions of US dollars to the PA.
Not a peep from MSLSD.
OK... and?
Another 150 million to the Palestinian Authority...
#1 - We give Israel that much of our tax dollars every 3 weeks.
#2 - It's going to Abbas and Fatah, NOT Hamas.
#3 - Having the west bank succeed is a good thing... because as the west bank grows and prospers, and the people in Gaza see more and more of what Hamas is preventing THEM from also having... you can be sure that Hamas will not win anymore elections (if they are not rigged that is), and the people will look for leaders that will give THEM the same prosperity, jobs, safety, etc... As the west bank rises, Hamas falls.
This is a good thing, and I agree that MSNBC should report it...
Good riddence. Hamas has done nothing for us but give us a bad name. they are backward-ass savages
The notion that "Israel is the only nation of the world that gets away with murder" blithely overlooks all the murders committed by the US that have been documented by (among others) WikiLeaks.
Israel is the only Country that Every One of It's Citizens have to go into the Military, Can Vote, Can Be In Government, get Educated and own land!!! But I guess that is a fault with You Jews haters right???
You need to check the casualty lists from the engagements between Israel and the Palestinians. See how many old men, woman and children were killed on each side and the totals. It is usually around 100 to 1 in favor of Israel. Not to mention that Israel continues to build on land stolen from the Palestinians. Peace is never going to happen because of Israel's policies and oppression. All they will do is continue to feed the US public the usual propaganda and send Bibi over here to make a big show when things get too hot.
For one thing They have 100 to 1 more People in Their Country!!! If Israel lose as many as They had there... There wouldn't be any Israel!!! They could not steal land that was Theirs first and second They won in 4 wars... The Palestine their have the same right to own land and build on the land!!! Has anyone ever tried to find out Who is having the building done there???
Isreal is defending it`s country the Palestinians are trying to destroy one,,if they spent as much time trying to build a viable country along side Israel.. instead of destroying it.. things could get resolved ..they rejected partiton in 1948 and their own state ..Isreal accepted it...that among many other factors starts getting to the heart of the matter. Israel is in their country and that reflects an historical and geopolitical reality...the Palestinians can have their own state which will also reflect a cultural political reality. but by trying to destroy another country,,that will only bring the house down on them...they are the agressors and the death tolls reflects that Israel is repelling aggression..and that the missiles against them are placed in populated areas where children .old people, women, men ..all types of people are killed ..but unlike most Palestinians whose goal is to kill all the Israelis .the Jewish state is careful to keep casualities to a minimum..in densely populated areas that are armed to the hilt with missiles and rockets...if Israel wanted to do what the Palestinians want to do to them.. they could have done it a .long time ago..Palestinans,, accept a state now!! and avoid being more the victim of the agressive policies of your leaders..-its they who are leading you to the slaughter..not Israel....that`s getting closer to the heart of the matter...
Thanks Sharon for that DNA report. Take those weapons away from Israel and the Palestinian. Make them sit down at the table, and come to an agreement. And let us not forget that American reporter, who was run over by that Isareli tank a while back. Good luck to them all, give peace a chance.
Taking the weapon from one doesn't mean the other side won't get them!!! The first war They had the Arab League had more weapons that Israel had... But Israel still won the war against Them!!! Israel would love not to have to have Arms like Any Other Country to protect Themselves...
Apologist for Hamas: See No Evil, Hear No Evil
A St. Petersburg Times correspondent stumbles blindly through Gaza, ignoring the worst aspects of Hamas rule.
I looked at this website. Do you contend this website has no agenda? I'm not going to argue the points of the article, but to offer this source as some sort of unbiased outlet, is disingenuous and academically dishonest.
To speak of the perceived "anti-Israeli" media, and offer proof of such through the introduction of this webiste, is hypocritical. To refute one biased source with another holds no weight. Not meant to be inflammatory, just my thoughts.
This Article is just a way to show that there are two different sides of each story!!! It is up to You to decide which is better... Is that to much to ask???
No, I think looking at both sides is very important. However, I have found that most ardent supporters of Israel enter with a closed mind, and will support Israel's policies regardless of independent, unbiased stories. I live in a predominantly Jewish neighborhood, Skokie, Illinois. Most of my friends are Jewish, raised here near Chicago. I am far more well read, and when I confront them with information, they don't really care. They have unconditional support for Israel, that comes from their parents and not any knowledge of what actually is going on. No support should be unconditional, and everyone should be accountable.