You're right... that is a VERY unpopular opinion, not to mention wrong and un-American as well. I'm probably the furthest from gay it gets, but judging or discriminating against someone for what they do in their private lives (as I'm sure he doesn't flaunt it while working at the school) is just wrong. What's the big deal??? So what if he's gay... does that make him any less qualified to do the job he's obviosly been doing well at for all the years prior "coming out"? What a sad sad world we live in where there is so much unjustified hatred.

A private organizatin should not be infringed upon by the government.

Wrong. A government is there to serve the public and protect it's people under rule of law from domestic, foreign and yes, even private entities when these entities infringe on the rights of the public.

He's the GYM teacher! What Christian theology is he spreading? I went to Catholic school and don't ever once recall hearing coach bring up God. Either way it's wrong and un-American. Christian school or not, discrimination is discrimination and that's not what our Constitution tolerates. If you want oppression move to Iran or some place similar that imprisons or executes you for being gay, but take your hate out of this freedom loving country. I'm not even close to being gay, but this topic irritates the hell out of me that people are that freaked out over something so realistically insignificant. Like I said in my other post, he was obviously doing a good enough job all the years prior to them finding out he was gay to have been employed all that time.

I fully agree with you, this is very un-American! So much so that they seemed to have moved this whole controversy to New Zealand!

Lol! Touche Horatio Sanborne... still however the same types of discrimination are going on here as well as New Zealand, like the article (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/38325537/) on here a couple days ago with the girl that wasn't allowed to go to Prom as a couple with another girl and was awarded $35,000 for it.

Oh yes, as we learned Lord Jesus Christ came into the world to condemn gay people and debunk evolution. This is a fine case of 'in your face' Christianity. I am better than you, God Loves Me and Hates you so go to Hell.

Church schools have every right to reach their religious philosophy.

However, when it comes to employment, it's an entirely different issue. Discrimination in the workplace - against gays, minorities, women, the disabled, or any other group - is not to be tolerated. The right to earn a living is one that must be protected against all intolerance.

Furthermore, this is a Christian school. I defy anyone to provide a quote from Jesus Christ sanctioning hatred or ill-treatment of homosexuals. He never did. Christ stood up for the oppressed and defenseless. This school's actions are most un-Christian behavior.

Good for New Zealand, for protecting this man and making him whole. I hope he can move on with his life. And shame, shame, shame, on this school - and ALL institutions - that promote discrimination of any kind.

"Actually, it makes him completely unqualified to teach "Christianity" as how can he be a homosexuality and teach Christian theology in which does not support homosexuality?"

Well, I don't know about that. You're clearly unqualified to write in English, and yet, here you are, writing in English.

I hope their next coach doesn't turn out to be a heterosexual pedophile. It'd serve the stupid school administration right, but not the students.

KJC: So it sounds like your argument is that we can't have teachers at a Christian school who don't fit 100% into your idea of Christianity... out of curriousity, does that idea also count out people who are divorced? What about someone who wears clothes of more than one type of fabric (Leviticus)? Should we stone the people who have the audacity to try and grade papers on a Sunday?

Nice touch, James.

I would love for your employer to fire you for your beliefs, and watch you cry like a school girl over the discrimination

Why is this so hard for some Christians? Homosexuals are completely unqualified to teach "Christianity"? Good, now let's start on the fat ones. Fat pastors and teachers are completely unqualified to teach "Christianity" because gluttony is a mortal sin. Besides, gluttony is a hard sin to hide. Forgiveness and love are what makes one qualified to teach "Christianity", not hate and self-rigthousness.

Physicist-retired

A christian school teaches more than just subject like Math and History... its about a moral stand, a walk in life and living by example... and they the teacher have to be the first example for the kids to follow...

this is not about intolerance and this guy could have worked in any secular school without any problems... I don't agree with secular teaching and evolutions theory teaching, but my kids are all going to secular school and you don't see me pitching tent outside the school with banners to protest because of that...

this time is not the Christians who went to pick up a fight... open your eyes all of you...

Maurizio,

I know all about Christian schools. I attended them for much of my elementary education. I came home with a bloody nose more than once - from the teachers, who believed in the 'spare the rod' philosophy.

This absolutely is about intolerance. And as I've said before, I defy anyone to provide a single quote from Jesus that promotes intolerance or discrimination against gays. Or ANYONE, for that matter.

Please, please, please prove me wrong. But I don't think you can, because Jesus taught love and acceptance. This is not a Christian school. This is a Bible school. The differences are enormous.

I know several Muslims who will have a drink from time to time but ask them if they want a piece of bacon and they will look at you like you are trying to poison them. In the Koran both are banned, alcohol arguably more banned than pork which they are allowed to eat if there is nothing else to eat. But religious people seems to think it is OK to pick and choose those things they find easier to follow than others. This especially seems to be the case with those "Christians" who don't have to follow anything except those things they think they can judge others on.

Personally, I would like to see what Christ said about the matter since he is the one we reportitly follow, not Paul or Mark. Oh wait Jesus himself said nothing on the matter. I'm guessing that's because he didn't feel the need to comment on it.

The school was correct on two levels, first homosexuality is against Christian principals and second a gay should not be teaching or coaching sports. Too many opportunities to influence young minds. The government has no right or business in private, non-government funded, education.

Physicist, you are wrong. The bible as a whole, and as written today, plainly states that the act of homosexuality is a grave sin and that the actors of homosexuality will suffer death for this sin.

Now, your precise statement about Jesus preaching "love and acceptance" is not a true assumption or statement. While Jesus did teach love of God's children, He didn't preach acceptance of sin, but acceptance of the individual. The crowd brought a woman to Jesus. They said this woman was caught in an adulterous affair and they were going to stone her to death, according to the law. Jesus, while doodling in the dirt, said "Let he who hath not sinned cast the first stone." After doodling for a while, Jesus looked up and saw that the woman was the only one standing in front of Him. Jesus said, "Where did they all go?" She stated they all left. Jesus told her, "Then I will not condemn you either. GO AND SIN NO MORE."

Jesus was never about accepting sin, but about accepting the person and bringing them to God. God very well knows that we are not perfect, but that does not mean we can sin willy-nilly and not have to pay for our transgressions.

And while KJC can't type very well, his comment is right on spot. The teachers, coaches, administrators, board members, AND parents are all role models for the children. In a christian school, these role models should be above reproach. HOWEVER...

The bible teaches that the ACT of homosexuality is a sin. Just as the bible teaches the ACT of heterosexuality is a sin outside of marriage. If this person was not practicing the ACT of homosexuality (abstinate) then the school had no legal or biblical right to fire him.

What influence are you referring to? He's coaching them and probably teaching them discipline.

I think christian principals need to change, yet again. Remember, it used to be okay to own slaves. It's very sad that people use the bible or religion to discriminate.

Zoocrew,

Where is the quote from Jesus about homosexuality?

Physicist-retired

these are not my words... but is neverthless the WORD that as Christians we are called to believe and follow: Roman 1:21-26

²¹For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened. ²²Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools ²³and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like mortal man and birds and animals and reptiles.

²⁴Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another. ²⁵They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator—who is forever praised. Amen.

²⁶Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. ²⁷In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.

I am sorry to hear that you have been hurt by catholic teachers, guess what, so was I. I was beaten black and blue by sexually frustrated nuns in the "Christian Catholic" institution were i grew up....

I don't believe in Catholicism i believe in God and in having a relationship with Him and as a Christian I am not saying that you MUST to follow us.. you can go your way its your choice...

but if you do come to my House, School or Institution, you Must follow my rules and code of conduct... gay people as well as any other human being regardless of the color, family background and to some extent belief, are always welcome in my church and in my house providing that they behave according to the rules that we have, else they will have to go....

the rest is only political BS and public spin to distract people from the truth.....

Kristin-441877

Jesus said that you MUST abide by every word in the Mosaic law, The Tora, we call it the Old Testament.. the point that he was making was that unless we are born again, we are under the law... and that we will be judged based on that LAW.. His words not mine...

But he also said that we have to be careful on how we judge.. and I personally always strive to choose Mercy and Grace....

but when i see these trouble makers, whose real agenda is to steer trouble and steal cash from organizations who try to teach some moral values as well as giving education...

The bible as a whole, and as written today, plainly states that the act of homosexuality is a grave sin and that the actors of homosexuality will suffer death for this sin.

I'm not acting. I'm really a homosexual.

belove48

Christian principles never changes are and have been based on the same book which is the only one we use.

however some people uses the words for their own gain and this saddens me because the Word is very powerful.

regarding slavery ... when did we ever stop from being slaves??? you just looking at it from the wrong angle... slavery never ceased to exists its just been transformed and modified to make you more co-operative, you (and I) belong to a society we are slaves in it and as such we have to behave accordingly you(we) are not and never be free......

Maurizio,

You seem sincere in your beliefs. But you are promoting a bigotry and hate that Jesus (if I understand him at all) would abhor. Why can't you see that?

You call yourself a Christian, but your quotes are all from the Old Testament - the book of the Jewish religion. Christianity claims to be based on the teachings of Christ. And I'm still waiting for a single quote from Christ on the evils of homosexuality.

and waiting, and waiting, and waiting...

This argument was used to prevent the court system from protecting race based discrimination. You're a racist, sexist, homophobic, republican slob.

Jesus embraced the whole of the old testament... that was is tool to teach the crowds and his words where clear choose the grace or choose the law

the law was clear about Homosexuality and a load of other sins.... and the point that he was making was that alone we cannot make it... we are by nature law breaker....

so the alternative is the grace he never said that the old law was outdated just that with His help we can fulfill it ..... Homosexuality is but one of the big issues mankind is struggling with.. and there is no such thing as "big sin and little sin", there is only sin.

you can call be bigot or old fashion or fundamentalist, however i am just repeating what is written in the Book... so my real fault is that I accept the book at face value... but please do remember that the words in the book are not mine.

Typical christianist, you've ignored the source of the discrimination that started this controversy. The gay coach was fired because he is gay, not because he was having sex with the little girl he teaches. Do you really believe that a man's career should be flushed away because his superiors, quite simply, don't like him?

Grow up!

Republican!!!!

Maurizio, I wasn't referring to being a slave. I was referring to people that justified owning slaves because they believed their religion said it was okay.

Maurizio, you say "Jesus embraced the whole of the old testament"?

Then why isn't it okay for us to kill our disobedient children, as Deuteronomy instructs? (Deuteronomy 21:18-21)

I think it's just wrong that good Christian schools are forced to accept black employees. Everyone knows that god cursed blacks with the mark of Cain so you can't be black and be a true Christian. And don't forget - god hates fags too. And women. And shrimp.

Physicist-retired, I see from you more intolerance than in any christians I know.... The liberal definition of a tolerant person is "someone who agrees with me on everything". The liberal definition of hate speech is "someone who disagrees with me". So sad you all just don't see it.

I'm no expert on 'liberal' definitions, so let me give you mine.

My definition of tolerance is allowing others to live their lives in peace, with equal rights and protections under the law.

My definition of hate speech is speech that demeans, diminishes, or inflames opinion against others who feel or act differently than you may think is 'right', especially when it has no direct impact on you whatsoever.

I speak out against intolerance. I wish I knew more Christians who would do the same.

Look at it this way his position was a girls basketball coach. I would rather have a gay man teaching my daughter, then a man who was straight that may end up hitting on her... Just a thought.

This issue should have been raised in the interviewing process...if the organization was a religious one...it has the right and the responsibility to properly provide notice that as a religious entity the belief and lifestyle choices of its employees will be as strongly considered as their professional and academic qualifications. There should be no question as to what goes into the employment requirements of this kind of organization.

you people who think that there's something wrong with a CHRISTIAN organization firing a person in a position to set an example, for being gay, are totally ignorant.. That guy is completely unfit to be in that type of position.. the belief system that they are trying to pass onto their students does not support a homosexual lifestyle. There's no more to it. Christianity has a stance against homosexuality... and in an atmosphere such as that, even in gym class, there's a close knit relationship where a teacher in ANY class is a roll model and is expected to portray characteristics that are leaning toward their beliefs... him being a homosexual contradicts the position he is expected to hold. I think it's so hypocritical for you idiots to impose YOUR beliefs onto a group who choose to live a lifestyle which conducts itself by their interpretation of a religious text. You fools are telling people to not impose their beliefs on others..... when in fact, you're doing the same to them.... GET A CLUE.. look at things with an open mind and see that you're doing what you claim they're doing.

Christianity has a stance against homosexuality

Or rather, the wingnut Christian sects are unusually bigoted. Normal Christians like the UCC, Presbyterians and Episcopalians have little or no trouble with gays, and even recognize and bless gay marriages.

Actually there is a growing split with the Episcopalians and Presbyterians due to the hypocritical stance on homosexuality. Christians who actually read the bible and believe it's teaching knows that it's a sin. but if that makes true Christians bigots, so be it.

All religious sects contain both bigots and normal people, and the bigots want to form their own sect.

Proud bigot in da house, yall! I actually believe the words in the bible and follow it's teachings. Proud Christian = Proud bigot.

I really hope someone isn't about to bring up the whole "pride" issue. I would really hate to waste my time explaining the bible to someone who doesn't even read it.

Its a good and valid question as to what guidelines an organization puts in place for it's employees, and how they go about making them aware of them during the process of hiring them. For example, MANY employers have rules against you having outside employment while you are working for them. Why? Because if people know you work for them and you have another job, it could cause several problems: People may think less of the employer because they think you don't make enough there to live on. The outside job itself my reflect poorly on the employer (stripper, etc). It may divide you time and energies away from the employer's enterprise or create other conflicts. Again, this is standard with many employers and employees are made aware of it when they apply to work there.

Most Christian employers have some sort of code of conduct that employees are expected to adhere to. If the guy knew this and ignored it then I have a lot less sympathy for him than I would otherwise.

It's not a matter of "judging" someone, etc...yes, that's for God to do. However, that being said...whether being gay is "okay" or not is not the issue. It is a "Christian" school and Christianity does not condone homosexuality therefore to expect them to go against their teaching and certainly what the students' parents are paying for (A "Christian" education) they should not have someone there that lives counter to their role as a place of Christian education. It'd be like expecting a Jewish school to put on a Christmas pageant each year, that would be counter to their role in providing a "Jewish" themed education. It's important to keep the issue in the context in which it is. This is not about "catching gay" and "judging" it's about whether an organization should be forced to have employees that go against its mission and values.

Kjc, please refrain from generalizing. Not ALL Christian denominations condemn homosexuality. There are some that do, in fact, accept and welcome people who are gay. Denominations such as the United Church of Christ, which is a mainline Protestant Christian denomination.

From Wikipedia:

The UCC can, and does, sanctify same-sex unions. The resolution "In support of equal marriage rights for all", supported by an estimated 80% of the UCC's 2005 general synod delegates, made the United Church of Christ the first major Christian deliberative body in the U.S. to make a statement of support for "equal marriage rights for all people, regardless of gender," and is the largest Christian denominational entity in the U.S. supporting same-sex marriage.

it's about whether an organization should be forced to have employees that go against its mission and values.

If the teacher wasn't Christian, valid point. Otherwise, it's EXACTLY about judging and "catching gay." I've had Christians tell me with a straight face that they don't want gays around their children "promoting their agenda" (whatever that is).

Nothing about the individual should matter, besides the fact that they would have to be a good coach and safe around children.

I personally think an islamic coach would be ok at a "Christian" school as long as they dont let their personal religion or sexual preferneces interfere with a job.

it's about whether an organization should be forced to have employees that go against its mission and values.

Not true. It's about discrimination in the workplace. It's a very slippery slope to allow employers to fire those who have opinions or lifestyles that don't agree with the 'organization's mission and values'. It allows for all kinds of oppression and subjugation.

As an employer, you are required to provide equality. New Zealand seems to understand this. I wonder when our country will.

All this talk about being gay....uh oh....I think I'm starting to become gay!

How come you never hear Jews espousing such hatred for homosexuals like their Christian brethren? Are not the supposed condemnations of the Old Testament the exact same ones found in the Torah?

As an employer, you are required to provide equality.

In the US we do seem to distinguish between religious roles and non-religious functions. I'm not sure whether a sports coach might not have a valid civil rights claim here too.

Christians are no less tolerant of homosexuals than liberals are of christians.

Christians are no less tolerant of homosexuals than liberals are of christians.

Bruce, I think you've confused "Christianity" with "bigotry". Many liberals I know are Christians, but they tend to be intolerant of bigots.

Crystal, you can home school your kids. Oh wait, then you'll be raising another idiot !!!!!

Oh, wow, Mark. Way to keep the "Judging" out of things.

I'm glad YOU don't generalize like the Christians do and pass judgement. That would be horrible, wouldn't it?

Jay-1545594

Any organization that would sanctify same sex relationship cannot by default be Christians.... even if they like to call themselves such..

Crystal: I agree with you, we as parents have no control over what is taught at our schools.

Mark: Why did you feel the need to insult Crystal for her comment? Do you think her comment was incorrect? Or did you fear she was opposed to having gays as teachers? She only said that parents have no control over what is taught and by whom.

Any organization that would sanctify same sex relationship cannot by default be Christians

By definition anyone that believes in and follows the teachings of Jesus Christ is a Christian. One does not have to step into a church nor join a congregation to be a true Christian.

I say that any man or organization that turns away a brother or sister simply because they are a homosexual are the ones that are acting in a non-Christian manner. These are the ones that give the religion a bad name.

Many Christians should emulate the Jewish attitude towards homosexuality. Then they would be more Christ-like.

You know, Christ encountered the woman at the well who had been caught in adultery. Christ turned to the crowd and said, "Let who is without sin cast the first stone", and the crowd went away. Christ then told the woman, "Neither do I condemn you..." But he DID end the conversation with these words, "Now go and sin no more."

Christ did not totally ignor the woman's sin, but acknowledged it as something he could (and did) forgive her for. He also admonished her to stop her sinful ways ("Go and sin no more.") He didn't accept her lifestyle and say, "Do whatever you want honey...." That is what the church today is being asked to do... To accept things that go against deeply held religious beliefs.

Any organization that would sanctify same sex relationship cannot by default be Christians.... even if they like to call themselves such..

And just who gets to determine who can be considered Christians and who can't, Maurizio? You? I don't think so. How can it be that in the 21st century we have people still arguing that their particular denomination is the only true denomination and all others are frauds? To think that way is not what I would consider rational thinking.

Thank you for speaking the truth and for sharing it with those who have not learned about our heavenly Father. who bring reproof and correction for sinfulness. I wrote a letter of the same manner to the Governor of our state. Spoke the same truth of the matter. To overthrow HB444. bottom line ignorance is no excuse. Get the knowledge and understanding before there's no more time to fix and turn around. I commend you for having the guts. You know the truth and truth shall set you free. My (tutu)grandma once told me. God don't lick with a stick. You'd have to start with the basics before they will open their minds and heart to the Lord, God and Savior before it's too late. God Bless you for having the strength and confidence to try and educate the minds of God' creation man, who should be intellectually savvy to all things of God's creation for us. Meaning man, Human Beings! God Bless you!

In all fairness the bible does not specifically say homosexuality is bad.

It says a man should not lay with another man, as well as not wearing certain fabrics and a load of other bizarre things which all christians have chosen to ignore.

Different Christians do interpret the "laying with another man" statement in their own ways. There are many different types of Christian. Thus that school may interpret this idea in a way that is gay friendly.

Personally I think that homophobes choose to interpret the bible in this negative way to perpetuate their hate. Like you.

Your ignorance is phenomenal Danielle

How so?

Please quote me said passage or passages which you believe has the bible state homosexuality is bad, so I may not remain ignorant.

"This school has every right to dismiss anyone who will bring this type of sin around children?"

And the minute he starts having intimate relations with a man in the classroom, he should be fired. He's a gym teacher doing his job. His personal life has nothing to do with his ability to perform his job. If it weren't for the parents and the school, 90% of the kids would have no idea what his sexual orientation is.

But it's ok for all the Catholic Pedophiles ooooppppssss I mean Catholic Priests to teach the kids ???

Ah yes, the bible thumping hypocritical post. I knew if I kept reading long enough I'd come across it. It was only a matter of time.

Citing gayness as a sin, and quoting always the sins of others, while still failing repeatedly to admit that the loudest and the most obnoxious people who profess their Christianity to the masses are themselves adulterers, which also, by the way, is another so-called Christian sin.

If every Christian on the planet would stop attacking gay people and simultaneously put all of their energy into convincing the lawmakers and the courts to outlaw divorce, then and only then would the Christian argument against homosexuality be valid.

Mark, nowhere in the article does it say he's a pedophile. He's GAY. Normal gays and lesbians are attracted by others of the same sex who have reached the age of majority.

Danielle, thank you for your well-reasoned and understated posts. Too bad the intolerance of those attacking you is exceeded only by their ignorance.

There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.... Galatians 3:28... hmm so it would seem that gays and transgenders have nothing to worry about cant lay with another male if there are no male or females....

Jay

I have to say I totally respect your response. It does provide evidence that the bible condemns homosexuality.

It can definitely be interpreted in that way.

My thoughts are that the bible does say a lot of things though, that we choose to interpret in one way or another. The reason we dont chose to acknowledge them or heed them is that they are no longer relevant.

I like to think that as the years have gone by our ideas and thoughts are being refined, and I think homosexuality is one area were we understand more about now. For Example, we do know now that people have no choice in whether they are gay. It could be argued God made them that way if you believed in god.

For example I think, but cannot support with documentary evidence that there may be sexist undertones within the bible. People chose to ignore these undertones now because they have realised that what was acceptable or common thought back so many years ago, no longer is. Our thinking has evolved.

I then think that the attitude to homosexuality is quite similar, if that makes sense.

I also question who said these things. Again I am no expert but I know not all the books in the bible were written by disciples, and some are passed on stories that have been rercorded. I sometimes think that not all words in these books are direct words of Christ.

I do know that some authority in the Christian world does actually decide which books are to be known to the public or not as well, so what generally has been released may have a skewered view point.

For those who quote the bible.

Can you tell me who wrote the bible and who decided what books would be included in it.

Chuck Norris?

Danielle, with all due respect, it doesn't really matter what any of us "like to think". The bible is either true or it's not. Christ either saves or he doesn't. Hell is either real or it's not. What you and I think about it really doesn't matter as far as its existence. It's like gravity or the easter bunny.... Whether I believe it or not has zero bearing on it's reality.

Right and wrong are always relevant. Just because people choose to disregard something because it suits them to do so does not make it less wrong or more right. Christianity teaches that homosexuality is not normal and should be shunned by those that follow the teachings of Christ. However, it is not the Christian's place to condemn those who live outside of Christ's teachings. Only God will have the authority to condemn those who refuse to accept His Son as Savior. Christians should remember the teachings of Jesus Christ and try to live their lives by His example. Just as He lived His life on earth...so must we who follow Him. Jesus respected all other men (including women) to make decisions for their own lives. However, I firmly belive that a Christian church or school has the right be impose a level of behavioral standards upon their employees.

Christianity teaches that homosexuality is not normal and should be shunned by those that follow the teachings of Christ.

Christianity, more specifically the Old Testament, taught many a thing as being immoral with corresponding ways to deal with the immorality that in today's society would ludicrous to think of as immoral and the punishments barbaric, immoral, and even illegal.

So once again the question has to be asked.

When most of the moral code set down before goat herders some 2000 years ago is looked upon as being irrelevant and even ridiculous for modern day man and society, what is it about this one of over 600 that makes it relevant and sensible where all others are not?

Pebbles, once again I stumble across your idiotic posts and I am mystified by them. At first I thought they were incomprehensible simply because of your poor grasp of the English language or perhaps because of age-related immaturity on your behalf. But now I see they are literally logically inconsistent.

You are advocating a nature subverts nurture view of homosexuality, in which people are "born as homosexuals due to a biological cause" - correct? As a biologist, I agree with you 100%.

But then you go on to say that homosexuality, despite being outside of the control of the homosexual to experience these feelings, is nonetheless a sin. Fine, I would even accept that if you then said that you were a religious individual - that would explain a large number of the things you have said in the past. So I ignored that statement.

But lo and behold, here you come with another post in which you agree with big E that God does not exist. Now, I will be the first to say that morality only superficially depends upon religion. But surely you must realize how utterly hypocritical you sound? It's as if you are simply writing (and poorly, at that) random posts to get attention. You're a troll.

So, I'm eternally curious now - if you do not believe in God and thus do not accept Christianity or Western religion, then from what moral code are you deriving your belief that homosexuality is a Sin?

Forgive me if that came off as a little too scathing, bit since your posts on morality in other threads were likewise all over the map, I'm truly curious as to whether or not there is some internal consistency to your moral compass.

Ya know, peebles, you can't prove their is no God just like I can't prove there is. However, I can point to the complexities of the universe (more complex than the intelligence of the smartest man has ever been able to build) and say that I think there is more evidence that the universe has a guiding, designing force than to believe it all happened by chance.

In fact, the simplest single celled organism is something man still cannot duplicate in all our infinite wisdom.... How did life come to be?! I hear stories of "primoridial soup" from which the simplest life forms began, but just how did non-living "soup" suddenly become alive? If the big bang is true, then what caused it? What existed in the hours before the big bang? For all it's supposed "answers", science still doesn't have answers to the biggest questions of all....

When I weigh all the evidence of the universe, I can only come to one conclusion: Someone or something a whole lot smarter than man designed it all, and it's certainly not the work of billions of years of "chance". I think it takes a lot more faith NOT to believe in a creator than it does to believe in one.

To be fair, the universe is indeed governed by chance at its most fundamental level. Einstein despised this, thus his famous quote "God does not play dice with the universe". But evidently, God does play dice with the universe. Without respect to quantum mechanics; however, the laws of physics that govern the weak, strong, electromagnetic, and gravitational force are indeed a mystery of origin. Without getting too technical, if they were altered in even a tiny way, life could not exist in this universe. This is called the "Goldilock's principle".

But you see, if abiogenesis does indeed occur, then it is governed by those very laws of physics. So while you may view abiogenesis as chance, that is rather superficial - isn't it? It is a bit more deterministic than that, as you may now see.

What it ultimately boils down to is - did the physical laws that govern our universe happen by chance alone, or were they written by the divine? Saying "God did it" answers nothing, even if that may very well be true. I imagine that the true answer may be more incredible than we could possibly imagine. If it turns out that a God was ultimately the source of it all, that makes it even more incredible - does it not? So, belittling science as a source of answers for the universe is not necessary - for if a God created it all, understanding the finer points of that God's creation is akin to a form of worship.

Yes, because who needs to come off as composed, literate, and moderately intelligent to others when attempting to argue a point? What a moron you are Pebbles. You have the reasoning skills of a twelve year old child. Actually I take that back - that's rather insulting to twelve year olds.

Also, did I miss the quote you were referring to when someone corrected grammar? - And did you just refer to the majority of the people above you as "gay"? Wow. Simply, wow.

Pebbles, I have challenged you countless times thus far to support your idiotic reasoning. Each time you have failed to rise to the challenge. That just makes you look like even more of a fool in the eyes of everyone here. So, I'll ask you again:

So, I'm eternally curious now - if you do not believe in God and thus do not accept Christianity or Western religion, then from what moral code are you deriving your belief that homosexuality is a Sin?

If you need to, please refer to the entirety of my post above in which I systematically demonstrate what a hypocrite you are.

Pebbles - "get a life"??? After calling the previous poster lame? What a child...

you cannot challange me what is their to prove, gay is wrong and you know it, no matter how you slice it.

Yes, I can challenge you to do so - because you spout vitriolic hate to everyone around you and post idiotic arguments in a public forum with no intent to support them with logic or reason.

its wrong biologically, yes animals do it yes be are evolved. Get it.

I have a hard time believing you understand anything about evolution or that you have even taken even an introductory course in Biology. I almost feel foolish commenting on the idiocy of this sentence, but nothing can be "wrong biologically". Wrong implies a moral stance, a moral viewpoint. Thus taking me back to my prior point, "from where do you derive your moral view that homosexuality is wrong if you reject God and Christianity?" Since you refuse to answer, forgive me for putting words in your mouth - but I'll guess I'll do it for you. You derive your morality from nowhere at all, as is evidenced by your posts in other threads. Your hatred of homosexuality is not because of a moral revulsion to it, but because you are a bigot.

you might know a bit more grammar and spelling than i do. but i know what is wrong and what is right, it seems you have not grasp the idea yet.

The sum of all your posts (that I have seen thus far) demonstrate that your moral compass is rediculously off-kilter. You have an intense hatred for homosexuals, animals, and anyone with a viewpoint different from your own.

if you notice the post its was pointing to the above post or do i have to quote everything everybody says.

Yes, this is why I was confused. Nowhere in my post (directly above yours) did I correct anyone's grammar. It was a well-articulated theological argument that is clearly above the scope of your comprehension. That is why quoting, as I am quoting you now, is incredibly useful.

you are one of those so called or think "better person". ha! ha! ha!

If you are implying that I think I am more intelligent than you...well, I hate to say it, but I'd have to agree. If you are implying that I think I am morally superior to you - then likewise, I would agree. Fantastic! We are in agreement at last!

get a life please a straight one.

Finally, I am not a homosexual - I assure you I am very heterosexual. But if you think that means that I won't stand up against bigotry, hatred, and injustice against gays then you have another thing coming my friend. That is a reward in and of itself, but you make it almost too easy with your illiteracy and childish comments - you actually resort to calling someone a homosexual when you can't logically back up your argument. Hilarious!

Run along young Pebbles, you are out of your league here.

youre not?? sure acts like one.

How's that?

its logic that you cannot comprehend, of course

Oh, the irony.

glad you took the time, to waste your arguement with me though, its been fun.

I've got to say, I literally lol'd at this. It's like you realize your own stupidity, and you are content with it! Hilarious. I "wasted my argument" on you. Are you sure you aren't a stand up comedian?

I just have to ask - are you for real, Pebbles? This is starting to strain credulity. I'm beginning to think you are just an internet troll that gets his jollies by acting like a moron.

I'd beg to differ with you regarding what the "me" generation cares about...granted it often seems like the "me" generation is so self absorbed they think of nothing but themselves but there are concerned young people in the world (me, for one) that cares very much about societal issues and whether what "goes on in the bedroom" comes out of the bedroom and into the schools.

What does what goes on in the man's bedroom have to do with coaching girls' volleyball? He's gay, for crying out loud! Those girls could NOT have been safer.

to flgal09: what if my sexual preference is to have sex with under-aged girls, would it matter to you then,and why so?since according to you we shouldn't worry about someones sexual preference .whether we want to believe it or not laws are made to give us a "moral" compass,and without them this world would be more chaotic than it already is. And just a note The Lord does love everyone but he hates our sins.

Prophet,

There are laws against having sex with minors. To my knowledge, there are no existing, enforced laws in this country (or New Zealand) against what consenting adults choose to do in the privacy of their bedrooms.

As for a 'moral compass', I don't need a book filled with talking snakes, ghosts, and virgin births to tell me what is wrong and what is right. Your bigotry and intolerance are wrong. Love, kindness, and acceptance are right. If you really understood what Jesus had to say, you'd know that.

Anyone with a clue understands, sexual preference, refers to male/female relationships, now if your supposed to be attending paedophilia type classroom mandatory court ordered, that would be the only reason I could possibly understand you wanting to have a relationship with a minor child. Please dont seek advice from me for your perversion, just attend your classes.

Of course it would matter then prophet. Because then there would be a victim and a crime.

Flgal: The "ME Generation" is associated with those between the ages of 10 and 40 years of age. There are numerous books that discuss this issue as well as a generation me website.

Well, I thought I fell into the "ME" generation group, I'm 44. I'm a baby boomer? Thanks for clearing half of this up lao.

I also laughed at all the "it's un-American!" statements? Did they even read the article?

Not only that, isn't being gay basically outlawed in most states? If you ask me, this is a perfect example of American lol!

Caleb, as far as the article stated, he was teaching physed not religion. Unless he was promoting his lifestyle directly in gym class, I see no reason the school was right in firing him. I'm also curious as to whether this private school was receiving state money of any kind. If they were, then they didn't have a right to dismiss him because a private entity receiving state money has to abide by the rules of the state that oppose discrimination by sexual preference, race, gender, etc. Most Christians believe that God made us all in his image, then gay people are also made in God's image (since God created everyone) and therefore have a right to employment just as much as a straight person does or are all of you conservative right wingers saying you know more than God does? Maybe God created differences in his people to foster love and tolerance. What I usually hear from those professing "Christian values" is hypocrisy and self righteousness. Doesn't sound very Christian to me.

Caleb, You're the first comment I've read that finally spoke the TRUTH! Thanks for sharing!

Caleb, sounds like you have been reading this gay gym teacher's mind.

Do you have some special "expertise" in the areas of mind-reading and/or gay gym teachers? Please share that, too.

By the way, the Bible isn't a science text, nor even a good description of the social world. It is arguably not even the Word of God! Instead, it's a bunch of stories written by MEN -- with all the failings of ordinary men -- and they were intended as tales to instruct poor people who couldn't read or write or think for themselves. I guess you joined the club.

But it's ok for all the Catholic Pedophiles ooooppppssss I mean Catholic Priests to teach the kids ???

Funny, I thought God made everyone.

Well Clifton, IF there is a God, he did create Adam AND Steve and Eve and the rest of us, for all that matters so PLEASE stop using that lame excuse. Whether Adam wants to love Steve versus Eve is none of your concern. I also find it interesting you make a blanket statement that all gays are perverts. I believe if you look at the statistics you will find self identified straight men as being more likely to be pedophiles than gay men. Pedophiles, my friend, are perverts. Those girls were completely safe to be coached by that man. SHAME on the school! SHAME on you!

Clifton, you make perfect sense. But, you didn't take the argument far enough.

We need to take away all rights for gay people, slowly and methodically. We need to take away their right to live anywhere near our schools. We need to take away their right to patronize the local libraries. Let's also take away their right to buy food at the local grocery store. In fact, let's make it a law that every restaurant must have one restroom for heterosexuals and one for gay people. Let's create a two-tiered monetary system and charge one price for the straights and another higher price for the perverts when they buy things. Let's invade and raid any business that is suspected of being either owned, operated by, or patronized by gay people. Let's create a new arm of government who, for no other reason, investigates the criminal elements known as The Adam & Steve's.

Let's burn down their houses. Let's punish any child severely and painfully for even intimating that they either have a friend who is gay or who is suspected to have participated in gay behavior. In fact, why not hang them? Why stop at just teaching a child not to be gay (if that is even possible) and just end their lives prematurely for even admitting they could have gay interests.

Then, let's pull out all the stops and focus on their ways and means of earning money. Let's tax them into the afterlife so that they have to lie and say they are straight in order to take advantage of the generous tax breaks their heterosexual friends enjoy. And while we are on the topic of lying, let's also punish them for being honest while they are serving their country and fire them for admitting they are gay, no matter how long they are served with honor in the United States Military. And don't forget those after-service retirement benefits that all heterosexuals receive...let's take those away as well.

Let's put a complete halt to every gay foster parent in America. Let's go one step further and keep those nasty perverts away from the concept of adoption. Let's start telling the courts that in spite of the statistics to the contrary, the bold faced fact is that gay people should be banished and forbidden to give a child a chance at a decent homelife when no one else would.

I am tired of being called a pervert from the likes of people like you. You know nothing of the bias and hatred that gay people live with on a daily basis in this country that we like to call home, and that which we are proud of.

You are a true blue hypocrite, through and through. You and your religion based arguments hold no water and lack foundation because the news headlines bear witness to the irrefutable fact that the real perverts are the ones who yell the loudest while they commit some of the most heinous acts imaginable. And, one of those heinous acts is called hate.

Do yourself a favor, fusseltier. Go out and talk to a gay person. Have an educated conversation with someone who has traveled down the road and the pathways of hate. Then take off your shoes and wear theirs, for a day, for a week, for a year. He wears his shoes in oppression for a lifetime, all because people like you don't know any other thing except being called a pervert by someone who has never experienced bias for who and what they are.

Maybe it's time for that. Over millions of years, we still haven't become civilized and let people live the way they want to.

How does someone's admitted sexuality preference make them an "admitted pervert"? This person is not an admitted pervert! You need help............

But it's ok for all the Catholic Pedophiles ooooppppssss I mean Catholic Priests to teach the kids ???

Interesting how the homophobes have no answer for you, isn't it, Mark1229?

I wouldn't want an admitted moron posting on the internet, but we can't change that now can we OP.

fibikerchick- Christians are not homophobes, they simply state what the Word of God says. This is what he says about homosexuality:

In Leviticus 18:22 God said "Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman; that is detestable.

Leviticus 20:13-"If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads."

Thank God we don't live in Old Testament times, under the Law.

Romans 1:27-28 "Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion. Furthermore, since they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, he gave them over to a depraved mind, to do what ought not to be done."

God alone will be the judge for their unrighteous acts.

why is it when people want to do what they want without any repercussions they mis quote judge not less ye be judged, the bible also says ye shall know real christians from fake ones by the fruit they bear, so what is that called? when the bible mentions judging it means we should not condemn someone or place a sentence on them for their sins, but it is right to say when someone is in error. jesus told the woman @ the well "go and sin no more" (john8:11) so its not the woman he hates its the sin. just like lying, fornicating,covetousness etc.which im sure this includes all of us but thats exactly why we need jesus! Halleluyah!

I don't think the school was concerned about physical issues, as moral issues. Your comment would lead us to believe that we should be concerned about a straight male teaching anything to female students, or female teachers that have male students.

Yes, Maurizio, and you are also a graduate of Wal-Mart University. To listen to your argument is to say that gay people are [in addition to being perverts] basically opportunists.

They seek out companies where they know they will be hated or subjected to bias so that they can get themselves set up for life with a hefty check from a lawsuit. It's the money, Maurizio, isn't it? I suppose the majority of the swoop and squat rear end accidents on the freeways are also perpetrated by gay people. Why not also blame them for ever increasing national debt and natural disasters?

Yes, Maurizio, gay people are a smart bunch. We know how to work the system in our favor, especially when it comes to being fired because of hatred and bias. It makes sense to us that if somebody is going to be stupid enough to end our careers - no matter how stellar they may be - that we're just gonna come back and teach you a lesson. We'll just sue you, screw you, blue you and tattoo you, to teach you the very same lesson you should have learned in your early religious training. That lesson was to love and respect all of mankind, and it's deep in the Bible if you'd care to look for it.

Think about it, Maurizio. What other recourse did the teacher have? Should he have walked away because of the injustice? Should he have become violent? What should he have done, Maurizio? Would you have felt better if he had just walked away and turned the other cheek? Would that have made it right in your way of thinking?

The money the teacher got comes no where near what he should have gotten.

Maurio; I am sure that all gays know that their lifestyle goes against the grain of most religious institutions, yet we often hear of cases such as this. And eventually a lawsuit is filed, and usually won. Got to admit, it's an easy way to pick up some extra cash from time to time.

Robert: No, he should not have just walked away and become a shrinking violet, he should have filed the lawsuit, and I imagine that this sort of stuff goes on quite often somewhere in the world. Heck, even though I am not gay I may give this stance a try if I ever get fired from a job in the future. Yes, this guy should have gotten a zillion dollars, and you should too for simply being gay. Cheers. :-)

Scoop, would you please tell all of us exactly what God's Law is? Could you please elaborate on the teachings of God's Law so that all of us can be better educated on the subject? And what is this garbage about the Gay Agenda being so unfortunate? Who are you, that you can stand up and proclaim that equality for everyone is so unfortunate?

Let me see if I understand your post thoroughly and completely. You say that if I am a gay man but I do not participate in gay behavior, that I am qualified to teach in a public school system. I can think gay thoughts, but I cannot act upon those thoughts. That means, in essence, I must remain on the diet but I can read the menu all I want to. All the while, at the same time, I also have to be content, happy, complete, whole and then I can have all of the other privileges the otherwise heterosexual world enjoys every living moment of their lives.

This is the moral equivalent of telling a Mexican he can think Mexican but he cannot love or have sex with another Mexican. You can be Jewish in your ways and means of living your life, but you cannot go to Temple. You can be African-American, which you obviously had a choice of not being before your were born, but you cannot engage in intercourse with another black man or woman.

You can own the car, but you cannot drive the car. You can have a computer in your home, but you cannot plug it in or use it. You can have children in your home as guests, but you cannot even think about the possibility of raising one of your own. Is this really a ludicrous argument scoop123? Is it really all that far fetched?

If you really believe that gay people will experience eternal damnation after their demise for homosexual fornication in the natural, then you need a wake up call.

You cannot deny that Jesus loved everyone, regardless of who they slept with. And a loving and generous Jesus would never have told anyone to think what they want to think, but just don't act out on it.

Robert

This one cannot really be answered without entering a delicate ground and without seriously offending somebody...

its true that Jesus loved everyone and that he gave all of us an opportunity to reconnect with God via the his sacrifice on the cross.

The gift is for everyone indiscriminately... however it is my(your) responsibility to actually take hold of the gift and accept it... and this is the crux of the matter not everybody wants it because by accepting it we admit that we have failed and so we have to do something to change our lives...

Promiscuity, fornication, violence, abuse, gambling, idolatry, greed, stealing, killing and homosexuality are but a few of the issues dealt in the book and resolved at the cross...

if you look at the small list above you will find that from a political legal ground all the items are somewhat acceptable by today's society

some people will go to some extent to jump on their high horse and look down at others for their faults....

I don't. I just say what its written and let you make the decision..

Yes Jesus loved everyone and died for all of us, but unless we accept what he's done for us is sacrifice has no value and we are therefore under the law.

I hope this provide you a better understanding...

Maurizio, thank you. My understanding is now so much clearer. I feel much better knowing that my gayness is on your list among so many other social ills. To be compared amongst the worst of the worst, my day now will be so much better.

It is because of your way of thinking that hate begins as a tumor. Given time and nurturing, the tumor matastasizes with its own momentum. You water it; you fertilize it and suddenly you have this blooming flower pot of hate. It's a flower pot because you make the hate pretty, when it reality all you are really growing are weeds.

We've never killed anyone and we've never stolen. Being monogamous, there is no element of promiscuity. You can't accuse us of greed because we work to support and provide for our elderly parents. We don't gamble because by the time all of our money is distributed to the grand children, there isn't any money left. Just about the only thing left on the list is our gayness. Thanks for throwing us into the mix.

Tell me sir, what threat is the homosexual lifestyle to you? What causes you to feel as though we had better shape up or God suddenly step in and ship us out? Better yet, what possible threat was the teacher in New Zealand? Am I to understand that heterosexuals are actually afraid of my gayness?

What is the actual, physical consequence of condemning my gayness and suddenly waking up one morning proclaiming straightness? What benefits will I enjoy - other than those already existing in everyday law - if I were to do? Have you spoken to anyone who has met with God and was told their gayness on earth would be adequate reason for denial to life everlasting in harmony and in the heavens?

So you have read the best-seller, and from reading it you have decided that unless you and all people around you follow the teachings of the best-seller, those who do not will not only burn eternally, they will also not receive the nod when they arrive at their demise.

All of us are entitled to our own beliefs and to follow a belief system, organized or not. But just as quickly when the words "Gay Agenda" casually drop into the conversation, then so too should the words "Religious Zealots" - to make it all fair and balanced.

In other words, you can call me what you want to and you can accuse me of being a Gay Activist. I can even go along with that line of thinking, as long as I can accuse you of being a religious fanatic.

Ed, self-described "Christians" should stop with the "gay-bashing" if you truely want to reflect the love of God. Leave judging others up to the Judge.

But it's ok for all the Catholic Pedophiles ooooppppssss I mean Catholic Priests to teach the kids ???

After seeing the same post over and over again, it's starting to add up:

Mark1229 == 666 "Mark of the Beast"

TW-417267

Nobody is bashing gays actually the opposite is true ... are you aware that politicians in many European countries are try to legalize same sex marriages and that Christian minister can actually be arrested if they refuse to marry same sex couples in church...

and after seeing the outcome on this school one question come to mind....

who's bashing who?

Really, Maurizio, you see equality as 'bashing'?

Furthermore, you are wrong about Europe. They want to provide a civil ceremony for gay marriage. No religious officials will go to jail over this.

And I'm still waiting for you to provide me with a quote from Jesus supporting hate or discrimination of gays.

*crickets*

Ed; You can have your own beliefs, you just have to keep your beliefs to yourself if you live in the USA. Cause sure as heck someone will feel differently than you and if your belief hurts their feelings you are then cast aside by the voices of hatred and called a variety of names due to your beliefs.

Christianity does not teach intolerance.. its more likely for a rugby player wanting to play football but using its own rules... and then complaining because they wont allow him to join in the team....

You wanna play football, there are rules to follow else go and play something else, somewhere else ... wanna work in a Christian Place, there are rules there too...

as I said before the guy was after a lump-sum, we're all aware off gay's rights.. I have many friends that are gays and I am also a Christian..

I just hate when people uses these cheap tricks to get on the news or steal money from working organizations because of their belief.

obviously you cannot rely on politicians to defend your rights anymore because they are too busy looking at their approval ratings... So I say well done to the school for standing their ground.

by the way, I don't condone Pedophile Priests, or Nazi Racism either

Thanks for the enlightenment. I appreciate the fact that "you have many friends that are gays..." I should probably start telling people that I have many people who are straights. That ought to make people feel all warm and fuzzy when I describe my heterosexual friends.

And your comment about the guy being after a lump sum makes a whole lot of sense also, and that you're aware of gay rights. It's called human rights - not gay rights. It's called equality and fairness, like Cesar Chavez fought for. You no doubt know who Cesar Chavez is, or have you forgotten he was one of the most prominent human rights fighters in this century.

So you hate it when people use what you call cheap tricks to get on the news or steal money from working organizations because of their belief. Tough. Gay people have suffered long enough because of the very mindset you expose in your post. To believe you is to also believe that we are out there just begging for the chance to file a false inequality claim so we can make some blood money.

Well here is a statistic that may surprise you: It is currently estimated that nearly 18% of the claims against the Catholic Church were not based upon truth, but were entirely based upon the pursuit of personal riches. Already, cases of recant are beginning to surface, from heterosexual men, who had falsely claimed they were homosexually abused as children.

So, if you are hating it when people use cheap tricks to get on the news or steal money from working organizations, start looking within. The Catholic Church is purportedly a working organization, and at 18 percentile of false allegations means someone was out there using cheap tricks, and it wasn't gay people. It was people in your own backyard, sir.

sorry but you are comparing apples and pears here..

The catholic church's having what's coming to them and rightly so... they have perverted the Christian faith right down to the core for too long.. they, as well as many other so called religious organization have manipulated the words in the Bible for personal gain and now finally the reaping the fruit of their labour.

This however does not nullify the words in the bible and the reality of Christianity (not Catholicism).. so you want to associate me to them sorry to disappoint you I am not...

the stand that the school has taken was right from a bible principles the fact that the school is of catholic background and therefore under lots of pressure to preform well in the public eye is another thing

if that was my school, I would never have bent to political pressure to apologize nor given the guy a dime for having lied his way in my school... But then again i am not catholic and i would never work for a catholic institution, so have nothing to hide underneath the tunic....

I wasn't trying to give you a warm fuzzy feeling when i said that I have friends who are gay... I have "friends" period. And I treat them all with the same respect and love... and as they take the mick out of my lifestyle I respond in kind...

but please don't come with the oppression story we've all been discriminated and oppressed for being who we are... at one point or another in life...

and just to clarify, a conman is a conman.....

And how did he lie, Maurizio? Were his credentials fake? Did he place false references on his job application? Was his government ID forged? Had he stolen someone else's identity to get the job?

Our 37 year old son (yes, Maurizio, we are as gay as they come and we have raised a child) is a teacher. He lied to no one to get the job; his credentials and his college education got him the teaching position. The vast majority of teachers are honest and hard working people who do what they do because they want to. Not necessarily because they have to.

Teachers teach. They don't [or shouldn't] bring their personal lives into the classroom, yet any person who has been involved in school affairs as we have been will tell you that heterosexual teachers do it, and they do it without consequences.

The teacher in the article did not lie. He stood up, stood strong and made them pay attention. It matters not that it happened in New Zealand. What matters more is that equality and fairness won out.

to withhold information that would cause to make a wrong decision is classed as a crime and his also punishable by law....

and he only stood up after, like a poor victim and because of the past oppression and discrimination and the fear of being classed as homophobic all of a sudden public opinion and politician jump on the bandwagon and make lots of noise....

this person failed to mention something that would automatically disqualify him for the job in such school... I would call this a lie... it has nothing to do with his sexual orientations...

teaching is vocational.. you bring yourself into it like it or not... you deal with people and they look at you as the source of knowledge...... if they don't get personally involved with the students then they have nothing to teach.